ESTIMATES OF EXPENDITURE FOR THE FINANCIAL YEAR 1ST APRIL, 2000 TO 31ST MARCH, 2001 (Paper Cmd. No. 2 of 2000)

Order read for consideration in Committee of Supply [3rd Allotted Day].

[Mr Speaker in the Chair]

Head I (cont.) -

Resumption of Debate on Question [9th March, 2000],

"That the total sum to be allocated for Head I of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100." - [Mr Chay Wai Chuen].

Question again proposed.

The Chairman: Prof. Low is not here. Prof. Chin.

Assoc. Prof. Chin Tet Yung (Sembawang): Sir, I would like to raise three matters concerning road safety. First, can the Ministry look into whether the entry and exit points on certain highways, such as the CTE, be resited, particularly one that involves a confluence of points on to the CTE. For example, first, the confluence of two exits, one from the PIE and the other from Toa Payoh, as we approach the CTE. Next, these two then converge on to the CTE just at the point when the CTE has an exit point into Farrer Road. This, I believe, is why every evening we see the sign, "Heavy traffic up to Braddell". In the same way from the other side of the CTE going towards the city, every morning we have virtually the same problem so that we see the warning, "Heavy traffic from Ang Mo Kio Avenue 3 or 1 to the PIE". Arguably, these must be the most congested areas and it may well be due to the misplacement of exit and entry points. So I hope that the Ministry can do something about alleviating the conditions by resiting exit and entry points on this particular stretch.

Second, could LTA look into more road safety indicators to prevent two bad habits? The first is the tendency of drivers and motorcyclists to cut into lanes or weave in and out of lanes, especially on the expressways. I wonder whether installation of devices, such as cat's eyes, would be one way of discouraging this irritating and often dangerous behaviour.

The second bad habit is tailgating, particularly, on bus lanes. Could the Ministry, for example, consider the use of chevrons on the roads, particularly on the fast lanes to indicate safe distances that cars should have between them. Too often, we have had multiple car pile-ups because of tailgating.

Third, could LTA consider the banning of fog lights? I know that, recently, LTA has responded in the Forum pages to say that such lights would be permitted. But very often, on clear nights, there appears to be a lunatic freak who drives a certain mark of car, I think it is German, who delights in switching on these lights that usually blind all others even if we were to view them from the rear view mirror. Such inconsiderate people never seem to learn the lesson. And such lights are supposed to be switched on when there are hazardous conditions. But in Singapore, these lights themselves actually form the real hazard. So I hope the Ministry will look into these matters.

Mdm Claire Chiang See Ngoh (Nominated Member): Sir, I have raised this issue in this House before and I would like to hear a commitment from the Minister that, at the policy level, his Ministry will review transportation safety for school children from the ages of 3 to 12 who are travelling to and from school in buses. The review will consist of working out the costs of fitting school buses with bus seats befitting the size and leg length of children of varying ages, beginning with those of a child as little as 3 years old. The review will address the costs also of fitting the back seats of the car with padding so as to cushion any concussion that may result from a sudden brake by the driver. The Ministry will establish and continually assess the driving competence of bus drivers. They would ensure that each bus has a competent assistant who is able to discipline the children by making sure that they are seated and belted and who is capable of crisis-management should an accident happen.

Sir, the Minister of State told me, during the last sitting, that there were no fatal accidents linked to transportation of school children in kindergartens. Therefore, there was no need for seat belts or to refit current fleet of school buses. I also learnt that the same vans or buses which are ferrying school children at other times are used by older students and adults as well, therefore making it less cost effective for the bus operator to fit his buses only for use by a limited category of young children.

Sir, for me, safety is an issue which cannot be compromised or calculated on principles of cost effectiveness. Unless we study the problem and the latest development on car fittings, we cannot be so sure that the cost is unaffordable. In any case, the principle of best practice on transportation safety must be safeguarded irrespective of costs and pragmatic reasoning. A speed limit cannot serve as a safety substitute. We all know that a sudden brake, even when driving at the slowest speed, can succeed in throwing the child towards the window screen and cracking his or her neck.

I urge the Minister not to delay in studying this issue seriously. It is better to err on the side of caution. We may not have had fatal accidents, but certainly, we must protect our children from being maimed due to our failure in not spending a few hundred dollars more in fitting out the buses. One real concern is the unhappiness of parents if they were to pay more for transportation because the costs of refitting the buses will mean passing the costs on to the users. Surely, if any government is capable of making its people accept a good policy despite its price hikes, it is our Government. And surely, the fear of unhappy public reaction cannot be a good reason for not doing something that is right in the first place.

Should the role of the Government be one of a protector in the interests of the school children, or that of a defender on behalf of the commercial interests of bus operators? The Government must balance this conflicting role in favour of the children. For me, as a mother, the decision is clearly evident. I will pay for my child's safety because he or she is priceless. For those parents who cannot afford it, the school and other supportive parents can help to subsidise transportation charges for their children. I repeat, Sir, our children's safety cannot be compromised.

Dr Teo Ho Pin (Sembawang): Sir, Singapore has 3,120 kilometres of roads and 700,000 vehicles on the roads. As we progress to become a vibrant metropolis, we will expect our roads to be more busy, especially during the night. We are also a fast ageing population and there will be a higher proportion of drivers between the age of 50 and 60 years old in the years to come.

To date, we have many different types of road markings and signages on our roads. The road signages come in different sizes, fonts, colours and shapes. These road signages are usually placed at ad hoc locations and can be untidy and sometimes confusing. The recent change of the tourist attractions' road signages to brown is indeed a correct step towards standardising our road signages and making them more user friendly.

Sir, there are also many road markings on our roads. Some of these road markings are necessary and also confusing. The extensive road markings on our roads also increase the maintenance cost, and affect the smooth flow of traffic as they need frequent maintenance and repainting.

Sir, I would like to seek the Minister's clarifications on the following:

(1) What is the policy for deciding where to place road signages and road markings?

(2) How much is spent on road signages and markings maintenance per year?

(3) What are the measures taken by the Ministry to ensure that all road signages and markings are visible, especially at night? 12.45 pm

Assoc. Prof. Chin Tet Yung: Sir, last year, the Ministry adopted the bold move of not fining the ERP violators from the start, but by asking them to pay an administrative charge and the relevant ERP fee. This has been seen as a good move by the Ministry which should be congratulated for this.

I wonder whether this example should not serve as a model for treating other types of offences that are, so to speak, victimless. I will give an example. Last year, a mother and her six-year old child was caught eating while they were leaving an MRT station. They had already gone through the electronic barrier and the mother thought that they were out of the restricted zone as it were. However, they were unpleasantly surprised when they were accosted while their mouths were bulging with paus and given summonses. The officer did not listen to their explanation, which was that the mother made a genuine mistake and it took two letters of appeal before LTA decided to let them off. But once again, may I say that I am grateful to LTA for letting them off.

However, this has led me to wonder whether we are doing the right thing by banning, for example, eating and drinking, when what we are interested in is to punish littering. It is not what we put inside our stomachs. Surely that is the issue. I am all for imposing fines for littering because that is definitely a matter of public hygiene. But banning eating and drinking, perhaps, needs reconsideration. Perhaps, a public education programme would be better.

Going through the Mass Rapid Transit Corporation's regulations, I can give other examples where the first response had been to summon the person and to give penalties. I refer especially, for example, to non-compliance with instructions of an LTA officer, $500 fine; entering into and remaining in train when it is full, $500 fine; feet placed on seats, $500 fine; spitting and littering, $500 fine; playing musical instruments, $500 fine; throwing missiles, $5,000 fine. I know all these fines are compounded but these are matters that I thought could be dealt with first by having a public education programme, rather than by imposing penalties straightaway on such undesirable modes of conduct.

Sir, I hope that LTA will consider reviewing their whole structure of regulatory offences to see whether the first response should be through the criminal sanction. Using criminal sanction as first response for certain types of conduct can be akin to using a machine gun against a guy armed with a bow and arrow. What I am saying is that a good public education programme should be tried out first and, if it does really become a problem, for example, if the trains become littered with rubbish, then I would say that the criminal sanction would be justified. I hope that LTA would pursue more the line of public education rather than punitive measures.

Assoc. Prof. Toh See Kiat (Aljunied): Sir, any visitor who travels on our roads will invariably get the impression that we have very new cars and generally green cars which do not pollute the air. That same visitor would be forgiven if he, at the same time, thinks that as far as our buses, vans, taxis and motorcycles go, however, the norm is that of a trail of black smoke. Perhaps, the authorities here give some special exemption from anti-pollution laws to commercial vehicles and motorcycles. That impression should be corrected.

Vehicles which spew pollutants reduce the quality of air that we rely on to live. It is an issue which we must address as a matter of survival. Vehicles using fossil fuels also drain our financial resources, as these fuels have to be imported at great cost from a cartel of nations which do not necessarily have our nation's interests at heart. Therefore, we must look at alternatives to the diesel or petrol driven vehicles for the sake of our health, finances and national security.

To cut our reliance on fossil fuels totally may not be feasible, but we can reduce that reliance. After all, we will be getting plenteous amounts of natural gas from Indonesia soon. Being a tropical country, we are also blessed with lots of free sunshine. There are many alternatives which use these sources of energy: electric cars which have become quite reliable with advances in, for example, battery technology; hybrid cars which allow electric cars to travel beyond the city; liquid petroleum gas (LPG) cars which use natural gas, and even solar-powered cars.

It is thus surprising to me that the Government is not putting in more effort to permit the use of such vehicles in Singapore. Could we not give tax incentives, for example, to those who import such vehicles and the fuel that is needed for such vehicles, or rebates for those who use these cars and tax reliefs for those who have to build the infrastructure, such as the fuel stations, to service and maintain such vehicles?

I look forward to the day when, because of such measures, we will have cleaner air, cheaper fuels and cheaper cars and, best of all, we can cock a snook at the petrol cartels.

Dr Lily Neo (Kreta Ayer-Tanglin): Sir, I would like to seek the indulgence of the Minister for Communications and Information Technology to consider the future of post-war classic cars in Singapore. We are referring to those post-war cars that are more than 20 years old and quite apart from those pre-war vintage cars that already enjoy special privileges.

There is a need to look into this matter now because most of these cars have 10-year certificates of entitlement (COEs) that will expire in May 2000. These cars are restored and well-maintained by enthusiasts and they are to be considered a heritage of ours worth preserving. The problem, Sir, is that the costs and returns to continue preserving them are too foreboding under these current circumstances:

1. the prevailing quota premium (PQP) is about $50,000 and this is far too exorbitant in relation to the car values;

2. a payment of the full PQP will not be commensurate with the usual amount of usage of these cars; and

3. the payment of PQP has to be on a 10-yearly basis in order to qualify for future COE extensions.

Sir, many of the owners are not able to afford the impending outlay for the COEs and they will have to either export or scrap their cars. This will be most unfortunate and it would, therefore, be good if the Minister alleviates the situation by endorsing a "classic car category" fairly soon. The more than 20-year post-war cars could then be accorded some privileges similar to those for the "vintage car category".

The Land Transport Authority would have to collaborate with the relevant involved parties to formulate the criteria and rules. It is necessary to be prudent and avoid two situations. Firstly, a "bonanza" situation should not be created in these cars and especially in the "new" 20 year olds when privileges are accorded. Secondly, an increase in the number of "bad" cars on our roads. This may happen when poorly maintained "new" 20 year-old cars get registered in the "classic car category" instead of being scrapped. Perhaps having the cars qualify for categorisation initially and imposing punitive transfer fees may ensure only valued and well-maintained cars remain in the scheme.

Sir, we are encouraged to preserve and to appreciate our history and heritage. In line with this, I would like to persuade the Minister to enable us to continue keeping our classic cars.

Mr Gerard Ee (Nominated Member): Sir, Singapore is probably the most expensive place in the world to buy and own a car. It all started many years ago when the car population exploded and there was a need to dampen the demand for cars to deal with congestions, which carries a high economic cost. We introduced the ARF, and then PARF, CBD, COE, RPS and ERP. There was a time when COE for bigger cars fetched a price of $100,000. In spite of the high cost of owning a car, demand for COEs remains in excess of the supply. This is partly due to the aspiration to own a car and to a great extent, due to convenience, bordering on necessity.

Much has been done and is being done to extend the network of public transport. Undoubtedly, we already have a public transportation system that we can be proud of. However, we only have to look at the queues of vehicles outside the schools to see but one important and indispensable use of the car. Many mothers have made the sacrifice to care for their young children and part of their daily routine includes the ferrying of their children to and from school for classes, ECA activities, and to tuitions. For the mothers, having a car is not a convenience, but a necessity. The alternative would be that their children would have to wake up before 5 am and prepare for the school bus, and what about the activities outside school hours.

We now have an effective means of dealing with congestion. We have in place the Electronic Road Pricing system that is unique in the world. Its effectiveness has attracted attention and I believe that there are interests shown by other countries to implement a similar system. As a result, the ARF has been reduced and the scale for road tax has been smoothened.

A broken down vehicle inevitably causes congestion. There is belief that older vehicles would have a higher tendency to break down. Well, new cars do break down too. In any case, cars being retained beyond their 10th anniversary are subjected to a revalidation of the COE, premium on the road tax, which amounts to 50% from the 15th year on, and an annual vehicle inspection. That is a lot to pay for any person. Whilst it is easier to explain about the revalidation of the COE, given that it has a validity period of only 10 years, it is almost impossible to sound convincing about the premium on road taxes since cars older than 10 years are subjected to an annual inspection. Of course, the inspection is to check on certain main safety aspects of the vehicle and cannot give much comfort on the overall reliability of the vehicle. Vehicles can break down minutes after passing a vehicle inspection.

Thus, as motorists, we bear with the costs. However, except for the ERP, which is usage based, other policies are non-discriminating. A person who uses the car occasionally for essential purposes only is equally penalised on cost as the person who uses the car indiscriminately, such as driving to the provision store just five minutes away. With the COE, the growth in the vehicle population is controlled. It cannot grow faster than the number of COEs being released.

With the ERP, vehicles are kept away from the main arterial roads to keep them relatively congestion-free.

It is time that those who keep their cars in good condition are rewarded. A badly maintained car will break down even if it is just a year old. Whilst whether a car is in good condition can only be determined by a thorough inspection, an effective alternative measure would be that if it is still running well, in spite of being over 20 years old, it must have been reasonably well-looked after.

I urge the Minister to:

1. introduce a more thorough annual inspection scheme for vehicles older than 10 years and remove the road tax premium on such cars; and

2. introduce a special scheme for cars older than 20 years for restricted usage. The main aim of such a scheme would be to reduce the ownership cost of keeping a car beyond 20 years. Without proper maintenance, it is very unlikely that a vehicle would be retained beyond 20 years. There are many well-manufactured cars that, with proper care, can be used on the roads for many decades. This will avoid wastage where serviceable cars are scrapped and worse, if it is replaced, our foreign exchange reserve will be drawn on to pay the foreign manufacturer.

A special scheme for older cars would benefit the retirees. We are making the call for active ageing. If we want older persons to remain in the workforce or volunteer their services, we should, at the very least, make it affordable for them to retain their personal mode of transportation.

The average person would make a major upgrade when he or she is around 45 years old. 20 years on, the person would be 65 years old and approaching retirement or retired. The person will have less use of the vehicle but would like to keep it. After working hard and contributing to the Singapore's economy all these years, it would not be asking much to make it affordable for him to retain his vehicle if he so wishes. He will be subjected to the ERP, like anyone, and would likewise have to use the vehicle discriminatingly. As a bonus, Singapore will have its own pool of heritage cars that would, in time, be viewed as vintage cars. We will have on our roads a living history of the evolution of cars used in Singapore.

For your consideration, Minister.

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang (Cheng San): (In Mandarin): Sir, most people in Singapore basically understand that as a small nation with limited land to use, we need to have a set of highly efficient land transport system and a vehicle control system, to make sure that our roads are free flowing. The roads and rail networks are like the blood vessels in our body. If the blood vessels are blocked, then the body will be partially or completely paralysed. Singapore is the only country in the world that has successfully implemented the COE and ERP systems. However, we cannot just depend on all these control measures, because clothing, food, accommodation and transportation are the four essential conditions in our life. When everybody wants to own a car and there are not enough roads for the cars to move, we have to do something. We have to build a very good network, a rail network or an integrated public transport system. These are very important to us.

The rail network has progressed very rapidly in the last few years. The MRT system enables us to travel from east to west and from north to south. The Airport line and the North-East Line will be completed in 2001 and 2002 respectively. An effective MRT system has also let us to make optimum use of our land. I would like to know whether the Government has any plans to extend the rail network to all the major residential estates, so that they could be linked up.

In 1995, the former Communications Minister, Mr Mah Bow Tan, and the GPC Chairman, Dr Tan Cheng Bock, visited many countries in the world, and recommended the LRT system in 1995. The LRT will become an important mode of transport in our HDB estates.

Prime Minister Goh Chok Tong announced the first LRT system in February 1996, and thereafter the Government has also announced LRT systems in Bukit Panjang, Sengkang and Punggol, and the people were very excited about this. After this, the residents in the other estates have been waiting and waiting, and yet they do not hear any news of LRT coming to their new towns. I would like to ask the Minister whether we are going to extend our LRT system to the other residential estates.

Sir, apart from the rail network, our road network should also be improved. Last year, in the Budget debate, I mentioned that ERP is a specific and effective cure, but not a panacea. We must expand our road network and to clear some of the bottleneck situations in some of our roads. It is like a patient who has an artery blockage problem. If necessary, we may have to get a specialist to put in a stent, so that the blood vessels will be free again. Otherwise, we may even have to perform an operation on them.

Sir, our CTE is like a blood vessel which is almost incurable. Recently, many private residential estates were developed along the CTE. In the north-east area, in my constituency, with the completion of Hougang new town and with Sengkang and Punggol 21 rapidly developing, with about 1,000 units being completed every month, I hope we could have a new blood vessel there, so that these areas will not suffer a stroke and become paralysed.

We also do not wish to see the CTE having more and more ERP gantry points. Otherwise, passing through the CTE will be a problem because we have to pay ERP all the way.

Dr Michael Lim Chun Leng (Cheng San): Sir, the North-East Line that is due to be completed in 2002-2003 will, of course, bring great relief to the residents of Sengkang, Punggol and Cheng San GRC in general. We very much appreciate that MCIT has helped to speed up the work. Unfortunately, the residents do face significant traffic problems because, as part of the MRT construction, there are significant road diversions.

There are a few points that we would like to raise with the Minister. Firstly, we would appreciate it if LTA can look beyond just the local diversion, because some of these local diversions prevent the opening of major arterial roads. This means that even though they do divert a small bypass but, for the estate as a whole, the roads are choked. For example, in Sengkang town, the main arterial road now is Punggol Road, which is an old road and, unfortunately, it cannot be widened significantly. So this causes significant problems and time wastage for the residents. We are looking at whether other arterial roads like Sengkang East Way or some other bypass could be opened.

My second point is on transport problems on a larger scale, like what my colleague has just mentioned. If we look carefully at how the town is growing, we are having about 1,000 new households moving in every month or so. At this rate of increase in the population, we do face traffic problems, not just locally, but also when going to town, congestion on CTE and other bypass roads. The ERP has helped to some extent but, in the longer term, we should really look at other expressways or semi-expressways to provide alternatives for the residents there.

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang: (In Mandarin): Sir, with more and more new towns being developed, like Sengkang and Punggol 21, nowadays the HDB estates are getting bigger and bigger. Sengkang is bigger than Ang Mo Kio, and the density is very high. There are more and more people in each new town. Therefore, we should have a very good public transport system for the convenience of the residents there.

I would like to know whether there is any coordination between LTA and HDB in this aspect, so that the residents would not have to move into a new town where there are no buses running. It would have been very inconvenient. Also, the construction of bus stops should also be planned in advance, so that they could be completed before the residents move in. In this way, they would not have to suffer from the strong sun and rain when they are waiting for buses.

We should also have some direct buses from the city to the new towns. For example, Service No. 572 goes all the way from Lorong Chuan to Shenton Way. Such an express bus service is very convenient for the residents, and many car owners may even turn to taking the bus instead of driving to town. However, I feel that this type of bus service has not received much attention, because the numbers of these buses are not found on the bus stops. Once when I went to this bus stop, I was not sure which buses were passing that way and whether the bus routes were still operating. I hope the LTA would encourage more operators to provide such direct express service so that the residents in the new towns would enjoy this benefit.

Dr Teo Ho Pin: Sir, in tropical Singapore, travelling can be quite uncomfortable for bus commuters and motorists, especially during the rainy days. Whenever there is a heavy downpour in Singapore, we will notice that some bus commuters will be standing on the seat at bus stops for shelter, while many motorists will seek shelter under flyovers, resulting in bottlenecks and traffic congestion. These motorists are also endangering themselves by staying at the road shoulder.

To achieve a seamless land transportation system, it is necessary to integrate the development and upgrading of bus shelters into the development guide plans. More micro planning efforts should be focused to ensure that bus stops are correctly positioned for the convenience of bus commuters. The authorities must coordinate more closely to ensure that bus shelters are provided expeditiously, especially in new housing estates. We also need to review the design guidelines of bus shelters and rain shelters. In many developed countries, bus shelters are simple, aesthetically pleasing, functional and maintenance free.

Sir, I would like to seek the following clarifications from the Minister:

(1) What is the policy for providing new bus shelters in new

housing estates?

(2) What is the progress of upgrading existing bus shelters?

(3) Will the Ministry expedite the construction of rain

shelters for motorists along expressways?

Mr Ong Kian Min (Pasir Ris): Sir, sweeping the road is not a very desirable job. With labour shortage and rising labour cost, it makes sense to use mechanical sweepers to clean our pavements. We have seen some of these sweepers being used today in a limited way. But it is quite comical when they try to navigate around trees, lamp-posts, high curbs and other obstacles, which are in their way on the pavements. Would the Minister consider setting some standard and uniformity in the design and building of our pavements, in such a way as to facilitate the more extensive use of such mechanical sweepers?

Sir, my next topic relates to covered linkways. Our Town Councils and LTA have, over the years, built hundreds of kilometres of these linkways. They do not come cheap, and I have been told that this is because, at times, major underground services need to be diverted. Apart from the high cost, sometimes the diversion of these major services have resulted in delays and caused irritation to the residents around there. A hole has been dug to prepare for the foundation and if the work does not progress, it may breed mosquitoes and our residents have complained from time to time. To me, a linkway is quite a simple structure, and can be constructed with lightweight materials. Perhaps no one has really sat down to work out a structure that could be used without the need of a deep foundation. I would like to ask the Minister whether an agency can be tasked with this responsibility of designing a structure that can be used uniformly across Singapore without the need of designers and contractors looking at it on a case-by-case basis, and designing it for that purpose, but to use a lightweight structure that does not require a deep foundation and therefore to reduce the cost of these linkways.

Sir, my third question is a simple one for the Ministry. How does a mother with two young children, aged 5 and 2 years, one of whom is in a stroller and the other has to be held by the hand, cross Alexandra Road safely from the Ikea side to the Anchorage Condominium on the other side of the road? By this, I am referring to the tragic accident that happened just before the Lunar New Year, where a Korean mother and her two young children were knocked down. Most of us had, at some point of time, young children, and all of us have experienced how difficult it is to use overhead bridges or underpasses because of the steps, when we also have groceries, shopping bags and a stroller The difficulty is compounded many times, to the point where pedestrians find that they have no choice but to risk dashing across the road. Why can we not install escalators? Even the very busy underpasses under Orchard Road and Scotts Road do not have escalators throughout.

I visited some cities in Germany in 1980 when I was studying in England. I was very impressed that they had escalators leading to their subway systems. They do not operate all the time, but are equipped with pressure mats like those that we have to open automatic sliding doors before motion detectors became popular. Sir, when you step on the mat, the system is activated and it moves. After a while, the escalator stops to conserve energy. That was 20 years ago. Do we have a lower standard of living today than that enjoyed by the Germans 20 years ago? 1.15 pm

Sir, we have a fast aging population. Our overhead bridges and underpasses have to be more elderly friendly and less cumbersome for people who are less than fully mobile.

The Minister for Communications and Information Technology (Mr Yeo Cheow Tong): Sir, first I would like to thank all the Members who have spoken.

Mr Chay Wai Chuen, Dr Michael Lim, Mr Goh Choon Kang and Mr Yeo Guat Kwang have also spoken on the ERP and the road system. I would like to take them altogether since they are all inter-related.

Let me begin first by highlighting some of the key challenges we face in the future with regard to land transport because that is very relevant to the solutions that we are having today and in the future. Today, Singaporeans make only about seven million trips a day and already, as we all know, some roads are very congested and during the peak hours the buses are all packed. We project that the number of daily trips will increase to 10 million by the year 2010, which is a 40% increase from today over the next 10 years. By the year 2030, the number of daily trips will increase to 14 million. That is a doubling over today's number. Such significant increases would not be a problem if we had plentiful land but, unfortunately, we do not. About 12% of our limited land is already used by the land transport infrastructure network. By comparison, 13% of our total land is used for housing. This shows that there is very limited scope to significantly expand our road network to cater for more vehicular trips and therefore the cornerstone of our land transport policy is, and will always be, an excellent mass public land transport system that is affordable, efficient, comprehensive in coverage and which can be an attractive alternative to private transport.

However, not all trips can be made on the rapid transit system or in buses. Goods being transported have to be transported in vehicles and these vehicles use the road system. Buses also use the roads and will continue to have an important role in serving areas not covered by our rapid transit system. Our vehicular population will also continue to grow as we cater to the growing demands for business and for the aspirations of our people to own cars. But because of land, and therefore, road constraints, we cannot allow our vehicle population to grow unfettered. Nor can we allow our roads to be congested that all economic and social activities come to a halt.

Hence, the Vehicle Quota System to control the growth of the vehicle population and the ERP system to control road congestion. These are vital components of the Government's overall land transport policy. They will enable more Singaporeans to own cars whilst ensuring that our roads, which are like our nation's economic arteries, as pointed out by Mr Yeo Guat Kwang, are kept flowing efficiently.

Dr Michael Lim was concerned about the ERP Phase 2B and the further expansion of the ERP system. The objective of the ERP Phase 2 is to address the increasing traffic congestion along the arterial roads leading into the existing Restricted Zone (RZ). Hence, Phase 2 of the ERP established this second cordon along the outer ring roads. As not all the roads in the second cordon are presently congested, LTA will implement Phase 2 in stages. The first stage of Phase 2 was implemented last year in September 1999, and seven gantries were implemented at the most congested locations.

Phase 2B, which is on the way, will have 11 to 12 gantries, and this will complete the second cordon. I would like to assure Dr Lim that we will be very careful and will only introduce these gantries when the traffic conditions at each of these locations become unacceptable. As Dr Michael Lim has also pointed out, whenever we have an ERP priced road, it tends to divert traffic to other parts that are not ERP-priced. This is, of course, to be expected. I think Singaporeans are very aware of the need to control cost. So those who find that the ERP rate may be too high, they will seek other alternative roads. In fact, this is one of the desired outcomes of the ERP system. When one road is too congested we price it. Those who find that the pricing is too high would then find alternative roads, or they can shift their travel times because there is some flexibility there.

So far, the ERP system which uses the user-pay principle has been very effective in influencing motorists' behaviour and has kept the traffic flow on our roads quite manageable in the day time. However, certain expressways are beginning to show signs of strain during the peak evening hours. If necessary, ERP may be extended to the evening hours on these heavily congested roads to ensure that the traffic does not come to a standstill. LTA is monitoring the traffic speeds on the congested expressways in the evenings and will recommend whether we need to introduce evening ERP in due course.

Both Mr Chay and Dr Michael Lim also asked about alternatives to ERP. Other than just simply increasing the rate for ERP, what are the alternatives? Sir, as I have mentioned just now, motorists do have alternatives. They can change their pattern of travel, their time of travel or, better still, they can switch to public transport. In fact, we certainly hope that more motorists will switch to public transport over time. LTA will continue to work closely with the Public Transport Council, SMRT and the bus companies to ensure that the public transport system is keeping up satisfactorily with the demand. We will also be speeding up construction of two new expressways and expanding the rapid transit system. I will go into this later on.

Mr Goh Choon Kang brought up a few points yesterday. He referred to the request that he made last month about reducing ERP rates for school holidays or certain periods of the year where travel is less. As I had informed him in my reply, LTA will look into his suggestion. I am happy to inform the House that LTA has studied the situation and has agreed that it is possible for the ERP rates to be revised during parts of the year as the travel pattern is definitely lighter. This coincides with the school holiday pattern. As we all know, many families go away during the school holidays and therefore the roads become noticeably lighter. So we will begin the first trial in June this year to coincide with the June holidays. The new rates will be designed to maintain acceptable speeds on the roads. We may adjust the rates from time to time, as we do with all the other ERP rates.

Mr Goh Choon Kang also suggested that we review the ERP charges for the restricted zones because during off-peak hours he mentioned that certain roads in the restricted zone tend to be very lightly used. Sir, the speeds measured for the restricted zone are based on a basket of routes that cover both the busy areas as well as areas which are less busy or less utilised and they are chosen to be representative of the average traffic conditions within the restricted zone. It is not possible to just isolate a particular road that is lightly used because within the restricted zone, all the roads are inter-related and inter-connected. For example, a certain stretch of Orchard Road may be very lightly used but, nonetheless, the traffic on that stretch can still end up in Bras Basah Road or other parts of the city and contribute to congestion. So we have to take the whole restricted zone as one. Nonetheless, I will ask LTA to monitor the situation closely within the restricted zone and see whether it is feasible to reduce the ERP rates during the off-peak hours.

Mr Chay yesterday also asked about the ERP and how does the ERP collection compare with the old Area Licensing Scheme. Sir, the ERP has resulted in a 25% drop in collections versus the previous ALS system. This is before even accounting for the rebates in road taxes. The drop is a very real one. It is quite substantial.

Mr Chay also asked about the COE quota for this year and whether LTA is going to introduce the recommendation to moderate the peak in the COE supply by his Committee which was made last year. Members will be happy to note that the COE supply will again provide for 3% growth in our vehicle population for the Quota Year May 2000 to April 2001. Based on LTA's computations, the COE quota for Quota Year 2000 will be 109,452. This is about 61% more than that of Quota Year 1999, and will be about 50% more than that of the current projection for Quota Year 2001. Although the GPC chaired by Mr Chay in its review of the VQS last year recommended that we moderate this peak in supply, my Ministry has decided not to do so. Let me explain why.

This is because we have implemented the GPC's recommendation that we use projected deregistrations of the current year rather than the actual deregistration of the previous year in computing the new COE supply. This has led to a better match between supply and demand. As the projected number of deregistrations will be high this year, there is a need to raise the quota correspondingly to match the peak demand pattern. If the Government were to arbitrarily moderate the quota, we run the risk that the moderated quota may be too low to meet the demand from deregistrations. As a result, this would cause the COE prices to spiral upwards. If the actual deregistration figure turns out to be higher or lower than what was projected, then next year's quota supply will be adjusted accordingly. LTA will be releasing the full details of the annual quota today.

Mr Chay had also asked whether the COE prices for cars have stabilised after the merger of the car COE categories from four to two categories. During the review of the VQS last year, the Committee had noted that the monthly quota size for Category 1, which are cars below 1,000 cc and Category 4, which are cars above 2,000 cc, was relatively small. It felt that such small quota size was undesirable as it was likely to lead to greater fluctuations in COE prices.

Since the amalgamation of the four categories into two, the COE prices in Categories A and B have seen some degree of stability, as anticipated by the Review Committee. For instance, let me give Members some figures. During the past six months, the month-to-month fluctuation in the COE prices in Category A ranged from 1% to 13%. Prior to the merger, there were wide fluctuations in Category 1 COE prices. For example, between October and November 1996, the fluctuation was 67% and between February and March 1996, the fluctuation was 80%. Between April and May 1995, the month-to-month fluctuation was 134%. Indeed, the recommendation of the Committee was a correct one. 1.30 pm

What about Category B? Category B COE prices have also stabilised with fluctuations between 1% and 11%. Previously, the fluctuations in Category 4 COE prices went up to as high as 42%. So that was a good recommendation.

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang and Dr Michael Lim talked about the CTE and the traffic access to the North-east part of Singapore and also asked what plans we have for expanding both the expressways and rail network.

Sir, to relieve the CTE congestion, I am happy to inform the House that LTA is developing two new expressways, ie, the Kallang Expressway (KLE) and its northward extension, which is the Paya Lebar Expressway (PLE). The KLE and PLE will provide an alternative road for people living in the North-east, such as in Sengkang and Punggol. I have asked LTA to look into speeding up the development of these two expressways. As a result, I think Members would be very happy to know that LTA would be commencing construction of both Expressways early next year, and will complete the KLE in 2005 and the PLE in 2006. LTA will also work closely with the bus companies to further improve the bus services serving the North-east area, so that those motorists who decide to switch to public transport would have an attractive alternative.

As I have said earlier, we will continue to expand the road capacity, but there is a limit to this, given our land constraints. Our growing transport needs must be met through a comprehensive and efficient public transport system, one of which is our rapid transit system. This will form the backbone of our public transport system in the years to come. The Government will be developing a comprehensive RTS network matching the coverage and convenience of systems in London, Tokyo and Paris. The venture system will comprise a close grid-like network of rapid transit lines. From the city we will have rail lines spanning outwards to the population centres, and there will be an orbital or ring line linking all the rail lines, and this will form a complete distributed network. We will have local LRT network to provide links to the MRT network within HDB towns and between HDB towns. So this is in reply to Mr Yeo. Yes, this will be done, but of course all this will take time to deliver.

All in all, the Government expects to triple the rapid transit system network from today's 91 kilometres to 270 kilometres by the year 2010. So in 10 years' time, you can expect tripling, and to again double it to 540 kilometres by the year 2030. Currently, LTA is already working on several new lines. They are the North-east line, the Changi line, the Sengkang and the Punggol LRTs, and we are retrofitting a new station on the existing East-west line near the Singapore Polytechnic. And soon, work will also begin on the new Marina line.

Sir, let me conclude by saying that we have put in place tough but very necessary vehicle demand management measures. The ERP and the VQS are key components of the overall land transport policy framework. The public transport system is, in fact, the cornerstone of our land transport system. The Government will continue to invest heavily in expanding our rapid transit system, and we will continue to work with the bus companies to ensure that there is an efficient and attractive bus alternative, and all these together will enable us to keep our car population growing while keeping our expressways and arterial roads congestion-free.

Mr Iswaran yesterday called for more consultation by LTA when planning new roads and expressways. Sir, I agree with him that it would be ideal if the road planners can consult everybody, from the conceptualisation stage to the construction stage. But there are constraints. Let me explain.

Roads are planned and built to support economic and social activities and to cater to traffic growth. In land scarce Singapore, road projects will inevitably affect existing land usage and buildings. Thus, when planning and designing a road, the designers will carefully examine various alternatives and alignment options. Their main aim is to minimise the land take in the most cost-effective manner. This is done very professionally and objectively, since the designers have no vested interests at all in the properties along the route. Furthermore, the road proposals will be closely scrutinised and are deliberated at length by the Master Plan Committee before they can be implemented. The Committee members comprise a number of representatives from Government departments and they will evaluate the proposals based on factors, such as traffic justification, economic value, land and environmental impact. Alternative road schemes are also examined for their feasibility. So it is not just one proposal. There have to be various alternatives.

We must recognise that the information on which plot of land or which building is going to be affected by a road scheme is very, very price-sensitive. Thus, such information should not be divulged when the detailed design is still under study and very much likely to be subjected to change. If property owners along the proposed route are consulted, I think, first, we can expect the prices in the area to fluctuate very significantly, and we can also expect objections from those affected. I think it is very natural for residents in the area affected to want to have a road nearby but not to have it affect them directly. The consultation process will likely result in protracted delays to the project and maybe even result in the project being abandoned, as we have seen in many countries.

Nevertheless, before LTA proceeds to implement a road project, it will brief the adviser of the grassroots organisation and even the grassroots leaders of the constituencies affected, of the implementation details and the schedule of works, so as to prepare them for the oncoming activities. LTA will also try to assure them of the various measures which are being taken to minimise inconvenience. The consultation will have an added benefit in the sense that this will allow the adviser and the grassroots leaders to also offer suggestions on how to minimise the inconvenience. So this is a very important process which we will continue.

Dr Michael Lim expressed some concerns about the impact of the MRT construction on the road system in Sengkang. Sir, let me, first, assure him that LTA and HDB do work very closely together in planning the road network for the new towns. The situation in Sengkang is, I think, quite a fair bit complicated by the fact that just as we are building the new town and the new roads, we are also having a very major MRT line going through it all underground. And we know that underground construction does pose a lot of complications to the road system.

In the case of Sengkang, it was decided in 1996 that LTA will construct some of the internal roads which are affected by the construction of the North-east line. This is to allow better coordination between the construction of the line and the construction of the roads. The roads affected include Sengkang East Way, Sengkang Central and Sengkang East Road, and I understand these are major roads feeding into Sengkang. The roll-out plan for the road infrastructure was worked out jointly between LTA and HDB, taking into consideration the pace of development in these two towns. Therefore, LTA is aware that a thousand units are being opened each month.

Sengkang East Way has since been completed by LTA at the end of January this year, and LTA has opened one of the two lanes in each direction. I will ask LTA to expedite its work and open the remaining lane, both ways, as fast as possible. Sengkang Central and Sengkang East Road were scheduled for completion only end of next year, and this is because Sengkang Central is a two-way road, sitting directly above the North-east line tunnel and the Buangkok station. Obviously, the road cannot be completed until the station has been completed. On the other hand, the Sengkang East Road is affected by the construction of the North-east line depot. I will ask LTA to try to expedite the work there at the North-east line depot and see whether we can schedule to move the completion date for the Sengkang East Road by maybe April or mid of next year, instead of December next year.

With regard to Punggol Road, this road, as mentioned by Dr Lim, was expanded by HDB to a two-lane dual carriage way road. However, because of the intensive development work on both sides of the road, I think this road tends to be very congested. Not only that, I understand that there is a lot of illegal parking along the road as well, and this has added to the congestion. So I will get the LTA to work with the relevant authorities to see what we can do about illegal parking.

Sir, I will ask my Minister of State and Parliamentary Secretary to answer the other questions.

The Minister of State for Communications and Information Technology (Dr John Chen Seow Phun): Sir, first, I would like to thank Assoc. Prof. Toh for his kind remarks on measures taken by LTA to improve road safety.

Road safety is a key consideration of LTA. And to that effect, LTA has set up a special unit called the Road Safety Engineering Unit which focuses on road safety engineering. It will continually review and identify areas for improvement and help to enhance road safety.

LTA has also engaged a consultant to carry out road safety review for all the expressways. The review has been completed for PIE, BKE, CTE and KJE, and it has concluded that these expressways have met our stringent road safety standards. LTA will follow up with some minor modifications that the consultants have suggested to further improve road safety on these roads.

Prof. Toh asked whether the review can be extended to other roads as soon as possible. Yes, LTA also plans to carry out road safety review for all existing major roads, and there are about 570 kilometres in length of these roads in Singapore. So it will take some time and we expect to do the review perhaps over the next three to five years.

Prof. Toh also asked that LTA tap the feedback and suggestions of the public to improve road safety. Yes, LTA welcomes public feedback. The public is encouraged to give their feedback through the LTA hotline or the Feedback Unit.

Dr Teo asked about the policy for road markings and signs. Road signs and markings are important elements in our road design for traffic management and to ensure safety of motorists. LTA has a signs manual for implementing road signs and markings. The guidelines in the manual were drawn from manuals used overseas, for example, UK and Australia, and adopted for local use. The manual has been updated from time to time to make it current. For instance, it is now being amended to include guidelines for the use and placement of variable message signs (VMS) used in connection with EMAS. We did not have VMS earlier. The signs manual sets guidelines for a number of things. For example, the siting of signs, ie, the distance from the decision point, the types of destinations to be included and the order they should be displayed, the size of the letterings for different speeds, the spacing between letters on the sign, the colour combinations for the different types of signs, for example, yellow on green for expressways, white on green for other roads, white on brown for tourist sites, etc. Also, the specifications of the material used are all in the guidelines. 1.45 pm

High quality materials have been used to ensure their effectiveness and to minimise maintenance cost. LTA has used durable thermo plastic painting with glass beads as road marking material for the lanes along our roads. This ensures that the carriageways are well delineated both in the day and night. However, the visibility of these markings may be affected by rain at night. One way to overcome this problem is to use cat'-s eyes or road studs, as proposed by Prof. Toh. LTA had used these studs mainly to delineate some of the turnoff points to the exit of the expressways. These studs are currently not used on the main lanes on the expressways because the safety impact on motorcyclists is still uncertain. In other words, what would happen if motorcyclists ride between lanes or change lanes. LTA will therefore continue to study the issue closely and see whether there are other options to address the issue. Earlier, Prof. Chin was proposing using studs to guide motorcyclists or impose a discipline on them. As I said, we have to also look at the safety issue.

As for road signs, electro reflective sheetings for road signs are also used to improve their visibility, especially at night. In view of the ageing population, LTA has been progressively upgrading the existing directional signs along our roads and expressways by using better grades of electro reflective sheeting. It also has a programme to upgrade our street name boards and traffic signs to improve the visibility of these signs.

Dr Teo also asked about the maintenance cost. Annually, about $2.5 million is spent on the maintenance of road markings and another $1 million on the maintenance of the 85,000 road signs in Singapore. The maintenance works include washing, replacement of old and damaged signs. This cost is not high, considering that a good maintenance regime is essential to ensure that the road markings and road signs continue to serve their purposes so that safety of the motorists is not compromised.

Prof. Chin commented on the exit and entry points along expressways. I assure Prof. Chin that the locations of the entries and exits along the expressways were carefully studied before construction. The present arrangement is considered to be optimum, in terms of traffic functional requirement, given the land available. It will be ideal if we could have exits from the entrance to expressways spread out. This would cut down confluence and convergence. However, with our limited land and dense expressway network intersecting major roads, junctions are frequent and necessary. In general, we will prevent access to expressways from the minor roads. However, in the case of CTE, which he has brought up, we have to provide for the connection to the major roads, such as from Braddell Road and PIE. If we do not do so, then traffic intending to join or leave the CTE has to go to the adjacent parallel roads, such as Thomson Road or Upper Serangoon Road, where traffic conditions are also heavy. The congestion at the CTE between PIE and Braddell is mainly due to the very high volume of traffic and partly also because traffic exiting at Braddell is backed up to the expressway.

Nevertheless, I note that Prof. Chin's real concern is the way in which we can reduce the traffic congestion. I would like to inform him that the LTA is constructing a vehicular underpass along Braddell Road. This underpass will be ready by December 2002 and will improve the situation at the interchange between the CTE and Braddell Road. LTA expects that, with the underpass in place, more green time would be available to allow traffic from the CTE to exit into Braddell Road, thereby easing the congestion.

On bad driving habits, LTA will step up its education programme. I believe that is what Prof. Chin would like to see, ie, more education. And LTA will continue to work with the Traffic Police and other relevant agencies to educate drivers on good driving habits and discourage bad driving habits, including dangerous lane switching and tailgating. Prof. Chin has also suggested using, what he calls, "chevron". Basically, it is a safe-distance guide marking on expressways to allow motorists to keep a safe distance. I would ask LTA to look into his suggestion. LTA will also study, perhaps instead of studs, whether raised pavement markers can be used to discourage dangerous lane switching.

With regard to Prof. Chin's concern about fog lamps, these lamps are designed to project a low and diffused light to assist the drivers to see road markings more clearly under foggy conditions when visibility is very poor. The authority decided to allow the installation of fog lamps to improve visibility following the bad haze experience in 1994. If approved fog lamps are properly installed, they should not blind other road users. LTA has advised vehicle owners on the proper design and installation of the fog lamps. During the mandatory periodic inspection, vehicle owners would be required to remove or cover the lamps, if their vehicles are found with unapproved or improperly installed fog lamps. Nevertheless, the LTA will continue to monitor the situation closely and, if necessary, step up enforcement of unapproved or improperly installed fog lamps.

Sir, now, I come to Mdm Claire Chiang's issue. She brought up the issue of safe transportation for school children again. I share Mdm Chiang's concern over the safety of our school children when travelling in school buses. But she seems to think that the safety of the school children taking school bus is compromised. I would like to reiterate to her that their safety is not compromised. That is because we have at the moment a number of measures. Firstly, for instance, we require the bus to fulfil stringent technical requirements. Secondly, we require the bus drivers to have a vocational licence and medical check-ups. Thirdly, we require the bus to have a bus attendant. Fourthly, the bus cannot exceed the speed limit of 50 kilometres per hour. All these measures have helped us to maintain the good safety record that we have. But, nevertheless, it is always good to see how we can look for other ways to enhance road safety.

So I would ask LTA to do three things. Firstly, I would ask LTA to monitor the safety records closely and look at trends and indications whether safety is being eroded. Secondly, I would ask LTA to discuss with MOE and school bus operators to find cost effective ways to enhance the safety. To Mdm Claire Chiang, perhaps she does not mind paying. But I think the cost effectiveness and cost levels must be a legitimate concern. If there is a diminishing return, I do not think it is wise to do something which may not be necessary. But we will look at how we can reduce cost, for instance, for installing seat belts or back padding, and so on. And, if necessary, I would enlist her help to look at how the cost issues can be addressed. Thirdly, I would also ask LTA to step up the training of the school bus attendants and the enforcement of their responsibilities. So I think these are the things that we can do instead of mandating that all school buses must install seat belts. Because, as I have said before, from our preliminary calculations, the cost implications are not a small one.

Sir, Mr Yeo Guat Kwang asked how we plan public transport and bus services in HDB new towns. At the planning stage of a new HDB town, the bus operator responsible for providing bus services for the town would put up the conceptual bus plan based on the bus service guidelines of the Public Transport Council. The bus plan would take into account HDB's inputs on the size of the town, ultimate number of dwelling units, estimated population, land use and road system for the town. Bus stop locations are also identified during the planning stage and are indicated in a road-related facilities plan. The authorities concerned, HDB and LTA, make provisions for these facilities at the development stage when the roads are constructed. There is an inter-agency committee and they meet quarterly and all these issues are discussed and implemented. In the initial stage when residents start moving into the town, the bus operator would implement bus routes to the CBD and other employment centres as well as links to the MRT station, interchange and amenities in nearby towns. The operator is provided with HDB's staging plans for the town's development and will introduce more bus routes in tandem with the growth of the town. Routes are planned in accordance with the travel needs of residents which are assessed through surveys at various stages of the town's development.

Mr Yeo also asked about the premium bus service. The premium bus service serves a niche requirement and it serves to complement the trunk service provided by the main bus operator. If necessary, we can always introduce such services. He mentioned about the publicity of such services. Yes, I would ask LTA to look into how we can get the operator to publicise them and to ensure that their numbers are displayed properly.

Dr Teo Ho Pin also asked about the bus shelters' design. Bus shelters are designed taking into account construction and maintenance cost as well as comfort for commuters. Most bus shelters today are three metres wide. Newer bus shelters have been installed with panels which serve to shelter commuters from the rain. Presently, about a quarter of all bus shelters have such panels. The design and construction materials of the shelters will continue to be reviewed by the LTA so as to improve comfort for commuters while minimising costs. We welcome any new ideas that Members have that can contribute to a better design. 2.00 pm

On rain shelters, LTA recognises the plight of the motorcyclists during heavy downpours and has thus constructed rain shelters under flyovers for their use. These are concrete bays, located away from the traffic flow to ensure the safety of all motorists. LTA has provided these shelters under all flyovers where space permits. LTA will continue to improve the existing rain shelters by expanding the bays to accommodate more motorcyclists, where possible. It will also explore ways to overcome space constraints, without compromising the safety of motorists. In view of our high rainfall, motorcyclists should also be prepared by having raincoats at hand in case of inclement weather.

Dr Teo asked me to update him on the progress of upgrading of bus shelters. In Phase I, LTA has upgraded nearly 900 bus shelters and there are more than 3,000 bus shelters to go. LTA will carry out the upgrading over the next four years and the plan is for LTA to call for tenders and to ask the contractors to design, build and operate these shelters. LTA will, of course, specify the locations and the design specifications for the bus shelters.

Mr Ong raised three issues. Firstly, he asked about the pavement design. With regard to standardised design for footpaths and pavements, I agree with Mr Ong that this would make sweeping by mechanised road-sweepers easier. LTA has, in fact, already introduced such guidelines. However, many of the existing pavements were built way before we standardised their designs, hence, the variety of different layouts and characteristics, as pointed out by Mr Ong. As most of these footpaths are still in good condition, it would be a waste of public funds to reconstruct them to the latest standards. We will replace them when necessary and, in the meantime, LTA will discuss with ENV on ways to improve the efficiency of mechanical road sweeping for these older pavements.

On linkway design, for the linkways built by LTA, LTA has adopted a few standard designs of basic form. However, these covered linkways are often connected to a variety of different amenities of different designs. Hence, there is also a need to see that the covered linkways can be designed to blend in with the surroundings. LTA tries to maintain a balance between the two. As for linkways built by town councils between flats and other buildings, HDB has, since 1997, provided 15 designs of linkways for town councils' reference to assist them and their consultants in the construction of linkways. The designs have been standardised to expedite processing time and cut down cost, which addresses Mr Ong's concern, and at the same time, provide a sufficient variety of choices.

Mr Ong also asked whether we can install escalators on overhead pedestrian crossings and underpasses. Escalators have been provided for many pedestrian overhead bridges which are connected to shopping centres. The reasons for installing them at shopping centres are, firstly, the heavy usage by pedestrians; secondly, the mechanical and electrical equipment will be under cover and protected from rainwater; and thirdly, if the escalators break down due to faults or vandalism, there are the security personnel at the shopping centres to put them back into operation quickly.

For expressways, we will build pedestrian bridges or underpasses with ramps. For other overhead bridges and underpasses, we will look into the various factors, such as site constraint for ramps, vehicular traffic volume, pedestrian traffic volume, cost-effectiveness of escalators and their operational problems, and review how safety and the need to cater to the elderly can be met. I believe I have answered all the questions.

The Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Communications and Information Technology (Assoc. Prof. Yaacob Ibrahim): Sir, Prof. Chin has made a call to MCIT and LTA to review the way we treat offences. I would like to thank Prof. Chin for his thoughtful suggestion.

Members will recall that the introduction of the administrative surcharge as a first stage in dealing with certain ERP violations actually arose from a similar suggestion made by Prof. Chin at the debate in the Committee of Supply last year. Here, I would like to point out that Prof. Chin's latest suggestion is somewhat different from his earlier one. The rationale for the introduction of the administrative surcharge for ERP violations was premised on the fact that ERP enforcement is almost 100%. Hence, any violation is mainly due to forgetfulness or carelessness on the part of the motorists. This is not the case for other offences, such as eating at MRT stations, when enforcement is more difficult and we would have to rely on public cooperation not to dirty our trains and MRT stations. While SMRT would like to avoid fining commuters, sometimes it is necessary to drive home the point that people should not engage in such inconsiderate behaviour. But, nonetheless, Prof. Chin's suggestion is an interesting one which I would ask LTA to look into.

Prof. Toh has asked whether my Ministry has any plans to encourage the use of more environmentally friendly cars on our roads. It is indeed true that today, there is an increasing awareness of the environmental pollution caused by the combustion of conventional fuels. Some countries have embarked on the development of green vehicles that utilise alternative fuels. Such green vehicles include electric, fuel cell and hybrid vehicles. Recent technological advances have placed such vehicles closer to reality and some have actually become available for sale.

From a land transport perspective, we have no objections to the use of green vehicles on our roads, as long as they meet established safety standards. As these green vehicles also occupy road space and they contribute to congestion, they will be subjected to the same registration and licensing requirements for conventional vehicles. As such, all green vehicles will similarly be required to pay COE and ERP charges.

But we recognise that these vehicles are less pollutive at the point of usage, as compared to conventional vehicles using petroleum-based fuels. Therefore, my Ministry is examining if tax incentives should be provided, as suggested by Prof. Toh, to promote their use in Singapore. We will carefully study this together with the Ministry of the Environment and Ministry of Finance.

Finally, I would like to thank both Dr Lily Neo and Mr Gerard Ee for making a call for a scheme for older cars or cars older than 20 years old. Today, as we know, there is a vintage car scheme where special tax concessions are given to cars manufactured before 1940. Under a restricted scheme, these vintage cars enjoy COE exemption and, in return, they may only be used for a maximum of 28 days a year. There are about 100 vintage cars in Singapore. Internationally, cars manufactured during the pre-war period are generally recognised as vintage cars. However, there is no international agreement on what constitutes a classic car. Some clubs and associations use a criterion where cars are deemed classic if they were manufactured more than 20 years ago.

In Singapore, there are currently about 31,000 cars above 20 years of age. I am sure Members will agree that 31,000 is quite a large number and that not all of them possess a heritage value. In fact, it is very difficult to assess the heritage value of these cars. Therefore, we must be very cautious about granting any concessions for such a large group of cars as this would greatly undermine our existing policies which are tough but necessary. Furthermore, we do not want a situation where there are too many old cars on our streets as owners take advantage of a generous concession scheme.

For owners who do not want to use their cars on a regular basis, there is an existing off-peak car scheme (OPC). Under this scheme, owners pay reduced taxes in return for using their cars during off-peak periods. Moreover, as we further shift the balance between the upfront cost of owning a car to usage cost via the ERP and road tax rebates, the financial burden for the retention of these classic cars under the OPC will further be minimised. Car owners and car enthusiasts may wish to consider the OPC scheme, which will help them to reduce cost somewhat although, obviously, not to the same extent as complete COE exemption.

It is difficult for us to justify COE exemption or the payment of a lower PQP for this large group of 31,000 cars when their heritage value cannot be ascertained objectively and definitively. The COE, as has been explained by the Minister, is a basic component of vehicle ownership in Singapore. COE exemption is given only to a select group of vehicles that include scheduled buses, emergency vehicles and those for the handicapped. Hence, any treatment for cars over 20 years old must be evaluated against the adverse impact they would have on our overall vehicle quota system. However, my Ministry will continue to review the feasibility of having a classic class scheme and what this would entail for Singapore.

Assoc. Prof. Toh See Kiat: Sir, with your indulgence, I did also ask the Ministry whether they could give us an update on the effectiveness of the KJE and if it will be extended to other expressways. Could I ask if Dr John Chen has an answer to that also?

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: I have answered him. The consultants have told us that the road resistance is good for this expressway and we have passed with flying colours. It will be extended to other expressways. At the moment, about 26% of our expressways are already surfaced with this new material. It is called drainage mix and it drains water faster and as a result of this drainage, it is less wet and therefore of higher resistance.

Mr Gerard Ee: Sir, could the MOS address the question whether with more stringent annual vehicle inspections, he could consider removing the premium on road tax for cars older than 10 years?

Assoc. Prof. Yaacob Ibrahim: We will certainly consider all these suggestions given by Mr Gerard Ee on whether or not such a scheme will be viable. But again, we want to remind Members that we have to balance this against the need for us to maintain a car population which is of a certain age and to also ensure that our roads are well-utilised and not congested.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen (Bukit Timah): Thank you, Sir, for giving me this opportunity to seek a very simple clarification from the Minister. The Minister actually touched upon the merger of COE categories in his reply and has said that it is a good proposal because it brings about very stable COE prices. May I remind him that in the Question for Oral Answer, I actually asked a similar question on merger of COEs and the MOS has replied to my question on the impact of the merger of COE categories, that is, the merger was based on non-budgetary consideration. In fact, it would be possible that the merging of the COE categories will bring about a lowering of revenue collected.

I would like to seek a clarification on page 18 of the Budget Statement for FY2000. It says, "Revenue for motor vehicles taxes is expected to increase by 35.5% to $1.6 billion and this is due to more COEs released for quota year 1999 and the registration of more vehicles with higher open market value following the merger of the COE categories and also the recovery of the economy." May I ask how could the Ministry, once again, under-estimate the impact on the revenue collected following the merging of the COE categories?

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: Sir, the reply given by my MOS to Dr Wang is correct. The merging of the four categories into two categories is not because of budgetary reasons. We did not do that in order to raise more revenue. So the answer is correct. My point to Mr Chay is also correct when he asked whether there is stability and whether it has helped to stabilise the COE prices. As the figures have shown, what the GPC Review Committee had expected has come true, that is, by merging the four categories into two, it has helped to stabilise COE prices. As to why there is an increase in the COE collections, the answer is very simple. As stated, the number of quotas for 1999 has been much higher than in 1998. Secondly, as the economy has recovered, the COE prices also recovered. Most car dealers will tell you that if you want to know about COE prices, look at the stock market.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: Sir, I am actually referring to the operative words in the statement that says ". the registration of more vehicles with higher open market value following the merger of the COE categories."

2.15 pm

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Which page is it?

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: It is at page 18, paragraph 4 or 5. In other words, the merging of the two categories actually resulted in registration of vehicles with higher open market value, ie, bigger cars.

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Sir, with the merging of the two categories, the advantage is that the user can decide whether he wants, with the same COE, to purchase a higher value car or a lower value car. In the past, we forced people to compete in the small category and having bidded successfully for Category 1, they have no choice but to buy a small car. Now, they can decide whether they want to buy a bigger car or a smaller car. It shows that the market prefers a bigger car and, of course, a bigger car has a higher open market value. That is the consequence and there is a choice, not because of our intention of trying to rake in more revenue, but it is actually to allow Singaporeans to have more choices.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: Sir, may I inform the Minister of State that some Singaporeans are indeed very happy to be forced to compete in the small car category. Today, they have no choice but to buy larger capacity vehicles.

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Sir, the Minister has also shown the Member the pitfalls of the small number of quota for category 1. And if we have a very small number, the COE prices tend to fluctuate, and that is not good. For any system, if there are large fluctuations in prices, it is not good. On top of that, experience has shown that the COE prices for Category 1 were not too far behind the Category 2 prices and, at times, exceeded the Category 2 prices. So we made a judgment and we feel that by merging, we actually eliminate the pitfalls and provide more choices. If we look at it as a whole, we feel that it is a better system.

Mr Gerard Ee: Sir, I just like to seek clarification on the subject of premium on road tax. I have always thought that the ERP was introduced to deal with congestion, and the vehicle quota system to control the car population. Having introduced these two measures, is there still relevance for a premium on road tax, other than penalising those who cannot afford to buy a new car and have to keep their cars for a further 10 years?

Assoc. Prof. Yaacob Ibrahim: Sir, I believe the premium that Mr Ee spoke about is for people who want to retain older cars. The reason why that is in place is that we want to ensure that we have a relatively young car population in Singapore. That is the policy that we have adopted. But, certainly, in view of the call now to consider whether or not there is provision for older cars in Singapore, we will consider all these factors in our review on the feasibility of having a classic car scheme.

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: Sir, I just like to reiterate that the stability of COE prices has been brought about at a price, in other words, at a price that some Singaporeans are unable to purchase small cars of their own choice.

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: Sir, the price of a COE and the price of a car are very much related to the state of the economy. When the economy is doing very well, when people are keen to buy new cars, they bid up the price of the COE. At the same time, having got the COE, they now have to decide what sort of car they want to buy. Do they buy a cheap import or do they buy a European import that may be double the price?

Last year, the economy did very well. Whereas in the past, a person with, say, category A, may have bought a small car, but because of the better state of the economy, he decides to buy a car which is of a higher value, and he gets a higher OMV. So, the system is one which is very open and it gives the consumers the ultimate choice - how much to bid, what to buy and how much to pay for the car. It is all within his control, and he has to buy something that fits his budget and pocket. And having got the COE, if they decide to buy a better car, who are we to prevent them?

Dr Wang Kai Yuen: Sir, from my experience of buying cars, most people will decide, first of all, what kind of a car they would like to buy. I do not think people will go and bid for a COE and having got a COE, then decide whether they want to buy a small car, a big car or a luxury car. Having obtained a COE, within a period of six months, unless I strike a lottery, I am unlikely to buy a bigger car than I originally planned to do so. I think the sequence that the Minister has illustrated is completely the reverse of what ordinary Singaporeans would do when purchasing cars.

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: Sir, I have tried to simplify it for the Member. Basically, when a person buys a car, first, he does not even bid for the COE, which is why the Committee came out with this proposal to have open bidding so that we can encourage more Singaporeans to bid and therefore be in better control. But the decision is made based on what is the COE price and, ultimately, what is the total price of the car, which is why I said it depends on what is his budget and what he can afford from his pocket. And that is the ultimate cost all roped in - COE, OMV, taxes, the whole works, which is the price of the car on the road.

Mr Inderjit Singh (Ang Mo Kio): Sir, I agree with Dr Wang that the decision to buy a car is made first before getting a COE. But I want to go back to the point that the Minister of State made on price fluctuations. In my opinion, why do we not let market forces decide, rather than we try to control price fluctuations. On one occasion, the COE price dropped to $50 and $50,000 on another occasion. We should let the market decide and if people decide to bid in that way, I think we should let it be and give the flexibility to the market.

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Sir, that is precisely what we are doing, to let the market decide what cars they want to buy. Let me ask you a question. How many COEs should we give to small cars? Who is going to decide? You or the market?

The Chairman: Could the Member please address the Chair?

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Sorry, Sir. Let me remind Members that before the merger, the numbers for category 1 over the years were dropping. And just before the merger, the number was only 100-plus a month. It was getting smaller and smaller. Is that desirable? And why is the number getting smaller and smaller? Because we have allowed a mechanism via the open category to allow the market to decide what choice of cars people want to buy, and that is the signal we were receiving.

Sir, Mr Inderjit Singh said that he agrees with Dr Wang that the people would decide what car to buy first. I agree with him. That is also what happened under the new system, which shows that people prefer to buy a higher cc car.

Mr Chay Wai Chuen (Tanjong Pagar): Thank you, Sir, for letting me join in the debate.

Since we made this recommendation in the VQS report, we have always been haunted by this issue. Actually, one of the terms of reference of the VQS study, I want to remind Members, is the stability in the quota prices. As a term of reference, that was one of the considerations. It was not a budgetary or fiscal revenue collection consideration.

The figure, as rightly pointed out by the Minister of State, for Category A, below 1,000 cc, was actually very, very small. As the figure gets smaller and smaller, the tendency for fluctuation in value becomes very high.

The Member for Ang Mo Kio asked about why do we not let the market decide. Precisely, there was this problem of great fluctuations in the prices of COE - we had an outcome of $50 and so on - and this was one of the issues that we wanted to address. I would just like to make this clarification that the stability in the COE prices was one of the considerations in the terms of reference. It was never a budgetary or revenue collection consideration.

The second thing is on the open market value. Actually, if the consumer wants to, he can still buy a smaller car and the OMV would be small, even in the present situation. But then the question is, what is the COE price that he will have to bid? The principle on which the Committee went by was that every user of the road is occupying a certain space on the road and should be considered equally, not just because somebody says his is a smaller car, therefore, he should be charged at a lower rate. If we want to address equity reasons, then let us address it through differential rates of taxation, road tax for cars and so on.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, as far as I can recall, we only had one point in history where the COE prices really fluctuated from a big amount to $50. Other than that, I think throughout the time the COE system has worked, the prices were determined by market forces. In my opinion, if we had continued with the old categories and let market forces decide on how to distribute the number of quotas for the various categories, I do not think we will see major price fluctuations, as what the suspicion is.

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: I shall close the debate by having the last word.

Sir, if we follow what Mr Singh has said, I think we are going to be in for a lot of trouble. His closing remarks were to let the market decide on the distribution. If we take it to the ultimate, we will only have one category. Is that what Mr Singh is proposing?

Mr Inderjit Singh: Why not?

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: I will remember that in the future. In any case, as regards price fluctuations, as I mentioned just now, under the old scheme, the fluctuations were actually quite significant, going up to 160% at one stage, month to month. I do not think that is really in the interest of the consumers, because I understand that most of the car companies take a buyer's order with the provision that the final price would depend very much on the COE price. If a car buyer works with a limited budget and the COE price is jumping like crazy and is going upwards, I think he is going to be on tenterhooks. So, it is better that we have a system, as proposed by the committee, that still allows the market to decide what is the final price for the COE, and yet having a big enough quota number so that while the market can decide, the fluctuation tends to be a little bit less. That does not mean that there is no fluctuation. If the stock market is going to triple tomorrow, I am sure the COE prices will likewise go up quite significantly, maybe not triple but definitely not in the current range of up to 11% or so.

The Chairman: I think hon. Members can continue this discussion over tea later. We have got to move on. Otherwise, we will not be able to finish with this amendment. Prof. Toh, can you move to your topic?

Assoc. Prof. Toh See Kiat: Sir, moving on from earth-bound issues to something a little more airy, literally - we live in an environment of liberalisation, deregulation and globalisation. Some of the main philosophies in such an environment is that we have regulators who are transparent, who would promote good governance in the market and ensure that regulators are impartial in all that they do. And, ultimately, of course, there must be market efficiency in services that are provided. We have moved in this direction in many areas. In the port, for example, we have decoupled the regulator from the port operator. So PSA and MPA were born. In the National Computer Board before it was merged into the IDA, they had interest in a certification authority. But when the NCB became the regulator, they divested their interest in Netrust. And we have also taken pains to divest the telecoms operator from the telecoms regulator, and the broadcast regulator from the broadcast operator. I just want to ask why we have not done this for the airport and therefore this is something that makes it an anomaly, not just internationally, but even in Singapore itself. 2.30 pm

Mr Chay Wai Chuen: Sir, the Port of Singapore is ranked as the busiest port in the world in terms of shipping tonnage as well as the top bunkering port. PSA Corporation made $1.1 billion of profit before tax out of a revenue of $2.3 billion in 1998/99. To me, this also means that there is plenty of room for competition for the regional ports to compete with Singapore. What is the Minister's view regarding the potential threats to these ports including Tanjong Pelapas and Port Klang?

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang: (In Mandarin): Sir, our seaport has all along been our pride. Credit must be given to all our cargo operators, the PSA group and all the port workers. Our port has now enjoyed a reputation as one of the busiest ports in the world and it has won praises from all quarters. For this reason, our seaport has become the favourite and true love of the ocean shippers in this region. However, we are troubled by recent media reports that some shipping companies, including NOL, are beginning to be unfaithful to us. They are falling out and they have forsaken their old love for the new love and singing "Good-bye, my love" to us.

These rumours are very strong. We keep reading it in the newspapers. The names of third parties such as Port Klang and Tanjong Pelapas are mentioned again and again. It looks as though they will soon become the new loves of the maritime industry in this region. I would like to know whether the Government has any good policy to ward off the advances of the third party so that we will not be forsaken by the shippers. Will the Maritime and Port Authority consider opening some of our berths for the shipping companies to operate and manage, like the way it is done in Hong Kong?

Mr Chay Wai Chuen: Sir, I would like to ask the Minister's view with regard to the privatisation of berth operations. There are several new ports emerging in the region threatening to take away business from the Singapore port. Of course, at present, the Port of Singapore is still ranked No. 1 and support services in Singapore are still superior compared to the regional ports. However, the prospect of major shipping companies moving over to privately operated berths in Tanjong Pelapas poses questions of whether the time is now ripe for some of our own berths in our ports to be leased out to private shipping companies to operate.

There are certain advantages for berth operations to be privatised. Shipping companies can lease their berths for a period of time. Since they have to pay for this they will have to maximise efficiency down the supply chain to maximise value. They can also plan to maximise the use of berths and plan their turnaround time for mother and feeder vessels to and from the region. There is no doubt that the Port of Singapore is doing well. There is also the need to see beyond tomorrow,

Mr Ang Mong Seng: (In Mandarin): Sir, actually, I was going to suggest that we use the cashcard instead of the toll coupon for our motorists to go through the Causeway. But, the Ministry has already made an announcement on this a few days ago. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the Minister for giving us this good news. But I have a few questions to ask the Minister.

Some motorists have already purchased a lot of these toll coupons. They have not finished using them. Although the Ministry said they can be refunded, there is an expiry date for these toll coupons. Secondly, they have to go to the Ministry for the refund. Can we allow them to go to the petrol stations or some other outlets to get a refund on their unused toll coupons? This will be more convenient to them.

Mr Chay Wai Chuen: Sir, although at various times it has been said that, with the explosion going on in the world of the Internet and e-commerce, the hottest thing in the not too distant future is the battle for bandwidth. Yet I am concerned about the state of our broadband Singapore One project. There are today about 30,000 subscribers to the Singapore One broadband multimedia since it was first launched commercially in June 1998. There is a general perceived lack of value in our broadband content. Many people get dissatisfied with the service and switched back to the narrow banding Internet service. My concern is also because of the high rate of technological obsolescence in this field. Why have we not been able to develop a sizeable customer base to sustain the viability of the project? This customer base is said to be around 200,000. How does the agency intend to go about developing this? Is there a time frame and content development to reach this base?

I feel the present scheme of charges for the SCV and Magix access is too high. Perhaps to give the industry more scope for business development, the Minister should consider separating the infrastructure provider from the content providers. For example, a service provider can run the infrastructural facilities leasing out the bandwidth and leaving the multimedia content business to others. In this way, we can give a more focused efficiency to players in the industry and to give value to the customers.

Assoc. Prof. Toh See Kiat: Sir, I have the same concerns as Mr Chay. We have for many years now a broadband capability called Singapore One. At the rate technology goes obsolete in this new economy, I fear that we might be building a while elephant, a monument to a grandiose dream that was not meant to be. I know there is a lot of talk about how effective and how useful broadband would be and I think we need to do something about this base of 30,000 that is not attractive to entrepreneurs providing content, because with 30,000 people they do not sell many, many things and they are not going to come to Singapore. But other than the issue which Mr Chay raised about lowering the cost for the end users, I certainly agree with him that the Government should look into making it cheaper for the end-users. Right now, cable-modem and ASDL are the two technologies used - perhaps we can look into wireless technology and allowing for some kind of competition that will drive down the prices, and perhaps for Government to pay for the infrastructure in the same way that we pay for the infrastructure in MRT and allow the operator to recover just the operation revenue.

The other thing about the broadband technology we have is that I think people forget that the real issue is not technology. We have the technology and we have the best that can meet the world's competition on technology. They say that Bill Gates is not really a technology genius. Bill Gates is a marketing genius. I think that we do not have the marketing genius where Singapore One is concerned. We have not been able to sell it well enough. We have not publicised it enough in the international arena perhaps and we get very little response also partly because the base is just too small. So how do we enlarge this base and how do we publicise this infrastructure so that the world will come rushing down to our doorstep. Perhaps we need a Li Ka Shing or Richard Li?

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang: (In Mandarin): I agree with the views expressed by Mr Chay Wai Chuen and Prof. Toh. In this era of Information technology, information and knowledge travel very fast from one part of the world to another. News on what is happening in this part of the world is transmitted very quickly to another part of the world. As such, we must speed up our efforts to equip our people with at least some basic knowledge in IT so that they would be able to use this network to obtain all the information they want, quickly and accurately.

The broadband network is a very important infrastructure. If we say that the land transport system is like blood vessels, then the broadband is like the nervous system in the body. We must spread it throughout the nation and everyone would have a feel of what is happening in the world in order to make appropriate responses promptly.

Since the Government is financing the development and construction of the land transport system, the MRT system and the telephone system, why is it that the Government has not considered financing the installation of the broadband network infrastructure, so that broadband access is more affordable to our people? From what I know, SCV's charge for use of the broadband is almost double that of Hong Kong's.

Mr R. Ravindran (Bukit Timah): Sir, the Internet revolution has taken the world by storm but to date the English language is the predominant language of the Internet. Increasingly it has become clear that Internet development will take place in other languages. The trends seem clearly to indicate the number of people who are going to use their native languages to access the Internet will increase in future. In fact, recently the National University of Singapore spawned off as an individual business which provides registration of domain names in other languages. Similarly, MITA in the past has encouraged the use of Chinese Internet by setting up the Chinese Internet Steering Committee which has now been spawned off as a business. In fact, I was very happy that recently Singaporean Business Enterprises has got together and spawned off Huayi.net. In view of the new development and the future prospects on the Internet in terms of usage by different languages, I would like the Minister to tell us what are the plans that MCIT, in particular, IDA has, for the future development of Internet, particularly in the Singapore context for the three languages, which are Chinese, Malay and Tamil.

Mr Peh Chin Hua: (In Mandarin): Sir, Minister Yeo Cheow Tong announced recently that the Government has planned to allocate $25 million in the next three years to give away second-hand personal computers to 30,000 low income families and to allow them to surf the Net for free. This is a very good idea. At the same time, every Singaporean above the age of 45 years will be provided with an e-mail account and personal website, thereby narrowing the gap between the computer savvy and the computer illiterate.

Nowadays, the business community is better informed of what is happening in the world through the Internet and e-mail. Through the use of personal computers, they can gain access to a wealth of knowledge and information. Therefore, we must be computer-literate.

NTUC has been offering training on the use of computer to the workers. Now that almost every family has a PC and the fact that housewives and senior citizens are in the habit of watching television programmes, the Ministry may want to work hand in hand with TCS to produce some documentaries on the use of computers and information technology, and teach them how to surf the Net. This is more effective and economical than employing 2,500 computer experts to go to the RC centres and teach the people there. We can also cooperate with TCS to telecast to our residents, particularly the lower income people, the latest news on network updates, and recommendations on interesting sites on the Internet.

In China, there are regular TV programmes on the latest developments on information technology. These are very informative and interesting programmes. It will help the people to understand IT better. I hope the Minister will consider introducing such programmes to Singapore.

Mr Low Thia Khiang (Hougang): Sir, the Auditor-General's Report highlighted weakness in computer security in the following Ministries and agencies: Ministry of Education, the Registry of Trade Marks and Patents, Maritime and Port of Singapore Authority, TAS, the Inland Revenue Authority of Singapore and the PUB.

Sir, we are all aware that with the advent of information technology and its usage, it is also associated with the risk of losing information, or worse, undesirable manipulation of the technology to one's advantage. Computer security lapse could also lead to a private citizen's sensitive information being revealed through the Government's database. I think the Government, being the user of such technology, should also be aware of the risks associated with it. The Government also has a public responsibility to ensure that the data it has on citizens are properly secured. I am therefore surprised that the Auditor-General found so many computer security problems in so many Government agencies. I therefore have the following questions:

(1) What is the security standard set by the relevant

authority?

(2) Is the Government sure that the standard set is secure enough to prevent some unauthorised access to the database?

(2) Who is responsible for ensuring that the set standards

are met? 2.45 pm

Mdm Claire Chiang See Ngoh: Sir, I raise this issue in the context of our current obsession with the spread and scope of information technology. Technology must be used to help Singaporeans access information, understand and use it appropriately. How do our Ministries fare in these functions?

Sir, in June 1998, a researcher analysed for me the webpages of the Ministries of Health, Manpower, Home Affairs and Community Development. On the whole, she felt that the webpages were not interactive, information was inadequate, sketchy and not updated, particularly press releases and speeches in each Ministry.

Yesterday, I had three of my staff spend a whole morning surfing these same Ministries and one more, the Ministry of Education. It was a morning well spent and it benefited the staff because they learned so much more about the Government and society. Their reactions were positive, indicating a vast improvement from the observations made in 1998.

Judging from their responses to the various websites, they look for three things. First, is clear information which is comprehensive and useful. For example, one staff in her 30s, single, was drawn to a list of assistance schemes and range of services the Ministry of Community Development offers. The website of Ministry of Health, to another staff, a mother of two, was comprehensive, thoroughly educational and user-friendly. She made special mention of two reports. First, the National Health Survey 1998, and second, Dr Yaacob Ibrahim's report on employment and employability. She benefited from both reports personally. As an older person, she is drawn to the setting up of Silver Manpower Centres in housing estates.

The website of MOM was an exciting one for two of my staff because of the long list of employment agencies posted on the web. They were particularly pleased about the Back-to-Work programme. I wish I will not lose my staff because of this information.

The website of Education was evidently the most thoroughly prepared, including information on the current system, a section on PRIME, Programme for Rebuilding and Improving Existing Schools and on Planning Ahead about educational choices. For parents, these segments are invaluable information. My staff drew my attention to the section on FAQ (frequently asked questions) and found them reassuring. They do not feel they are the only ignorant parents or kiasu ones. She also liked the segment on Episodes from the Singapore Story, particularly the photographs, etc.

The second thing they look for is an interactive format. Here, the Ministry of Home Affairs, apart from being comprehensive and informative, must be singled out for its colourful layout and interactive format. One regret was that, unless you have CD-ROM, you cannot access the eCitizen Corner. So there is a suggestion for setting up a chat room for young people to express their fears about school bullies or gangsters to policemen who can then serve as on-line mentors or befrienders. Can the various Ministries consider setting up a chat forum, like the one in Ministry of the Environment, particularly for the young?

The third thing they look for is fast response. One staff in posting her suggestion to MHA at 11.22 am that morning had an immediate screen response that said: "Thank you for your feedback. We will seriously consider your comments and will get back to you if necessary. Have a nice day." She was pleased by that and she exclaimed, "Hey, they got my message!". To her delight, that afternoon, at 4.23 pm, an e-mail from a Mr Daniel Tan Chee Kiang (Corporate Communications Division) indicated to her that they had accessed the eCitizen Centre hyperlink and invited her to try it one more time. He thanked her again for bringing this matter to his attention. In the words of my staff, "this is the kind of interactive communication we need for Singapore, well done Home Affairs!".

Sir, I urge the Ministries to assess and update their websites regularly. There are inconsistencies. There are still incomplete information. For example, MCD has a Shop Front retailing books, but when it comes to payment and the procedure of application, there is no information, no procedures being set, and no indication of postage or courier charges, etc.

Judging from the responses of my three staff, I observed that this information is important to them. But my three staff also asked one basic question: what if you do not have a computer, how do you access this information? An even more fundamental one, the one that Mr Ravindran just mentioned, is what if you cannot read and write English? I hope the Ministry will look into these issues and fully exploit the Internet as a form of raising public education, making information user-friendly and accessible for promoting mutual understanding between Government and the people sector.

The Chairman: Mr Jeyaretnam is not here. Dr Teo.

Dr Teo Ho Pin: Sir, despite the advent of IT, letters still provide a common means of communication among individuals and businesses. Due to labour shortage, Singapore Post has been adjusting the collection time of mails from mail boxes and relocating some mail boxes. This has increased delivery time of letters and also caused inconvenience to some people.

To overcome this problem, I would like to suggest the following for the Minister to consider:

(1) Can we install outgoing mail boxes in all residential blocks? This will facilitate the posting of mails by residents. At the same time, postmen can conveniently collect mails after their mail delivery time.

(2) Can we relocate mail boxes along roads, especially main roads, so as to reduce traffic congestion or provide parking bays for such mail boxes?

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: Sir, I would like to thank all the Members for their suggestions.

Prof. Toh See Kiat asked about CAAS and why, in contrast to what we have done in other areas, CAAS is still both an operator and a regulator. Sir, CAAS has actually managed to serve both roles very well, and that has served Singapore well. In the process, it has made Changi Airport into the premier air hub in the region. We did look into the necessity to privatise CAAS. That was done in the early 1990s. We had a firm of consultants to help us look into it, and the conclusion was that there was no really compelling need to corporatise or privatise CAAS at that time.

As an airport operator, CAAS has actually done a wonderful job. The commercial operations in the airport are actually farmed out to private sector operators. For example, the airport ground operations, such as passenger check-ins, baggage handling, cargo handling, and the in-flight catering, are all done by private sector companies such as SATS and CIAS. As a result of all the efforts to improve the airport, Changi Airport has consistently been rated as the best airport in the world for many, many years. Despite the fact that CAAS is a statutory board, it has not rested on its laurels. It has continued to introduce new concepts and new facilities to the airport, because competition at the airport level is not just regional but international as well. And with more long haul aircraft coming in, I think the competition is going to be even tougher. So we need CAAS to remain on its toes.

One of the key projects that CAAS is now embarking on is the development of our Terminal 3. The construction of Terminal 3 would start shortly. When completed in the year 2006, Terminal 3 will increase Changi Airport's capacity to 64 million passengers from its current 44 million. So CAAS is looking into the future, and it will continue to take the necessary steps to maintain our competitiveness. Nevertheless, I can assure Prof. Toh that we do revisit the question every so often, because we need to be clear in our minds as to whether the time has come to separate those two roles. So we will continue to revisit that question.

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang and Mr Chay Wai Chuen spoke on the port. They asked about competition from other regional ports and how do we fare against the other ports, and whether we have benchmarks. Both Mr Yeo and Mr Chay also asked about the possibility of allowing dedicated terminals to operate in our port.

Sir, competition from regional ports has indeed intensified in recent years. I am sure Members would have read about the efforts to improve Port Klang, the opening of the new Tanjong Pelapas port, which is right next to us, and efforts by ports elsewhere - Sri Lanka, Indonesia - to upgrade and to improve. In fact, some of these new ports or upgraded ports have publicly stated that their intent is to not just emulate PSA but to take business away from PSA. Tanjong Pelapas, our new neighbour, has publicly stated that it is targeting taking away 10% of PSA's business. So the competition is going to be hotting up.

Port competition is not new to Singapore. It is something that we have faced all through the years. But more importantly, port competition is not just from regional ports. Because today the concept of hubbing and treating the whole world as one huge network means that shipping companies can hub as far away as, for example, Malta, for the region. They transship in Malta or they can transship in Colombo when it comes to shipping containers into our region. So the competition is not just from neighbours but it is really from further afield as well.

I can assure you that PSA does take all this competition very seriously. They have embarked on a lot of activities to improve on their competitiveness. PSA and both MPA monitor very closely several indicators, for example, port connectivity. How many ports is PSA connected to? Because the more ports we are connected to, the more we will be used as a transshipment centre. They monitor productivity, how many containers are moved, loaded, unloaded. And they also monitor what is the value for money that users get from our port.

Members will be happy to know that we are connected to more ports in the world by more shipping lines than any other regional ports. PSA also currently holds the world's record of moving 234 containers per hour from one ship. The competition is not really just on price alone. Many commentators comment quite wrongly on just basing on price. Because we know that you can pay a very low price for some goods but you get no value. Whereas if you pay a higher price for other goods and the value is there, it is still worth the while paying the higher price. And that is what PSA sets out to do. It does not compete to be the lowest price provided. They strive very hard to provide the highest value for your money. And this has resulted in growing business for PSA and our port even during the recent financial crisis. On the question of dedicated terminals, both Mr Chay and Mr Yeo asked whether we will allow dedicated terminals. Sir, the Government will introduce competition to the port as and when that competition proves necessary and beneficial. So, for example, the cart services have already been fully liberalised and port users now have a choice of six cart operators to choose from. In the area of container terminal operations, PSA is currently the only operator for main lines in Singapore. As I said just now, it does not mean that PSA is a monopoly because PSA has to compete for transshipment business with both regional ports as well as ports in the South Asian and Middle East regions. 3.00 pm

Transshipments make up more than 80% of PSA's business. As Members would be aware, transshipment cargo does not have to use PSA. They are not meant for us, as final destinations, and they do not originate from us. Therefore, the fact that they use Singapore must be because we are able to add value to their business.

What about dedicated terminals? For those Members who are not familiar, dedicated terminals refer to port terminals that are managed or owned by shipping companies to handle their own cargo. Because of the heavy investments required in some ports, some countries do invite shipping lines to come in and set up their own terminals. But quite often, those dedicated terminals are present in what we call "gateway ports", that means, the bulk of the business from the shipping line is with that country where the port is sited. So if there is a lot of outward and inward shipment of containers to that country, it may be worth while for the shipping line, if the shipping line has a lot of business, to operate its own port rather than use another port.

On the other hand, PSA is known as a common user terminal for our operator which shall serve all ships calling at our port. PSA has done a very good job, as I mentioned just now. As a result, Singapore is now the key transshipment hub in the region. We were No. 1 port, in terms of container throughput, last year. This year, we have fallen to No. 2. But it still shows that PSA has a very dominant and successful business. The high volume of cargo allows PSA huge economies of scale. And as a result, this makes it attractive for shipping companies to use our port to transship to other ports. So in a way, this becomes a virtuous cycle. The more they use us, the greater the economies of scale, and there will be more feeder lines serving us, and the business builds up.

When charting the course of the future, we must continue to understand what are the reasons for a common user port to be successful and what are the reasons that shipping lines want to have their own dedicated terminals. For the present moment, we do not intend to have dedicated terminals, but we will keep an open mind. We will have to watch the dynamics of the business and the changes in the shipping business. If good reasons exist, we will definitely look seriously into having dedicated terminals in Singapore.

Mr Chay Wai Chuen, Dr Toh See Kiat, Mr Yeo Guat Kwang and, yesterday, Dr Michael Lim talked about broadband multimedia. They commented that they are not very competitive. This is a very important industry and service. And we should make all efforts to make broadband multimedia a success in Singapore. Sir, let me first explain that the broadband multimedia market is still in its infancy in all parts of the world. In the USA, broadband adoption is only 6%. In Singapore, we have about 30,000 subscribers, or about 100,000 users, and the 100,000 users comprise about 14% of all Internet users. So in terms of penetration rate, broadband penetration in Singapore is actually higher than in the US. From what I hear, we are one of the highest in the world. We were one of the first countries to spot the tremendous potential for broadband and as early as 1996, we put in place the Singapore One network which is the backbone of the broadband network. We want to have a large and vibrant broadband industry in Singapore because this would contribute very greatly to our goal of becoming an infocomm hub in the Asia-Pacific. Because of its importance, the development of broadband is in fact one of the key elements in my Ministry's Infocomm 21 Masterplan.

To grow the broadband industry, as mentioned by both Mr Chay and Mr Yeo, we need attractive content and also a large subscriber base. Both feed on one another. It is like a chicken-and-egg challenge. Which one comes first, broadband content or subscribers. We feel both are important. We can attract more content providers if we can get a large subscriber base. On the other hand, as mentioned by Prof. Toh, the subscribers find that the content is not attractive and not very exciting. Therefore, they do not want to subscribe or they are reluctant to subscribe. Another factor holding back subscribers is the high cost. Compared to USA, our broadband access is more expensive.

IDA is working on three initiatives to develop our broadband sector. Firstly, it is wooing new content providers to come into Singapore and provide content and hub from Singapore. Secondly, we are also assisting the existing ones to upgrade their services. In fact, yesterday, I mentioned about the three marketing trips by IDA and EDB. Recently, my Minister of State also went on a trip to the US and the objective of the trip is also to reach out to broadband content providers to get them to come and locate in Singapore. So, in effect, we are actually marketing very aggressively.

The second initiative, and this is very crucial, is that we are working very closely with SCV, SingTel and, later on, StarHub to reduce consumer prices. In fact, SCV, arising from our discussions with them, has already gone ahead to reduce their prices. I understand that they are quite competitive compared to the regional service providers. With full liberalisation of the telecommunication sector, I can assure Members that we should expect to see broadband prices coming down in Singapore in the months ahead.

The third initiative is that IDA intends to open access to the infrastructure to other Internet service providers. By opening access, I think it will make the broadband sector more competitive and attractive and we should be able to see more subscribers arising from that. We also expect to see new technology being introduced, wireless transmission of broadband. That is definitely in the works. And we hope to see the wireless broadband transmissions coming in later this year or early next year.

Mr Yeo asked why the Government does not subsidise the development of the cable infrastructure since it is so important. Sir, let me first clarify that the Government does not subsidise and pay for the telephone infrastructure. The telephone company actually makes the investments and they expect to make a commercial return on those investments. Similarly, the cable infrastructure is an investment made by SCV and they use it for both their cables and broadband transmissions. I would think that SCV and its shareholders would expect to have some returns on their investment as well. Nonetheless, the Government recognises the importance of the broadband infrastructure in our development into a regional infocomm hub. We expect that while today, many of the Internet subscribers are opting for narrow band, more will migrate to broadband because the contents will be better and prices should be coming down.

It is for this reason that we supported the roll-out of cables to HDB flats and private residential estates. The Government, through the HDB, actually contributed $16 million towards the cabling of HDB estates, bringing broadband to all HDB households. HDB flat dwellers do not have to pay any upfront charges at all for the cable infrastructure. In addition, the Government has, through IDA, helped to lower the overall costs of broadband subscription by subsidising 70% of the cost of the head-end equipment and the cable modems required for broadband services. For the private homes, the cable infrastructure has been rolled out to the kerb. Because of the high costs of laying the cables to low density private housing, SCV has decided to charge individual house owners for the last mile of cable to their homes.

I would like to assure Members that my Ministry will continue to strongly promote growth and development of broadband in Singapore and we expect the introduction of full and open competition in the telecommunications sector to help us achieve our objective of growing this important sector.

Sir, I will ask my Minister of State to answer the other questions.

The Chairman: Order. I intend to take the break now.

Thereupon Mr Speaker left the Chair of the Committee and took the Chair of the House.

Mr Speaker: Order. I suspend the Sitting and will take the Chair again at 3.35 pm.

Sitting accordingly suspended at 3.12 pm until 3.35 pm. Sitting resumed at 3.35 pm

[Mr Speaker in the Chair]

Debate in Committee of Supply resumed.

[Mr Speaker in the Chair]

Head I (cont.) -

Dr John Chen Seow Phun: Sir, Mr Ang Mong Seng raised two questions regarding the refund of unused toll coupons now that, with effect from 1st April 2000, cashcards will be used to pay tolls at the checkpoints. The first question he asked is whether there will be a deadline for refund. I will ask LTA to consider giving a reasonable length of time before they impose a deadline. The second question he asked is whether the refund can be obtained at outlets like petrol stations and so on. LTA is currently looking into arrangements to allow for more designated places where refunds can be obtained. They will announce the outcome in due course.

The Minister of State for Communications and Information Technology (Mr Lim Swee Say): Sir, the other day I was walking down the street and I saw this lady walking in front of me, wearing a T-shirt. At the back of the T-shirt, it was written "The answer is no". I was very curious of what was the question in front. So, I overtook her and in front, it was written, "The answer is still no".

Sir, I have listened to the various cuts put up by the various Members with an open and receptive mind. I want to assure them that I did not come in with any pre-conceived ideas. Let me respond to some of the cuts that were presented by the Members here.

Yesterday, Mr Iswaran touched on the issue of a digital divide. 59% of households in Singapore today have a PC at home and 42% have access to Internet. In fact, Singapore is one of the most IT-intensive nations in the world today. However, we feel that the threat of a digital divide is still very real. The question is, why?

If you look at the penetration of home PCs, for the 1-to 3-room HDB flats, it is only 41%, compared to 78% for the HDB Executive flats and private housing. Among the people using computers today, only 1 in 5 is more than 40 years old, and 1 in 20 is more than 50 years old. In fact, 80% of computer users today are those who are younger than 40 years old. In terms of educational qualifications, among the computer users again, only 1 in 6 is a primary school leaver, 1 in 3 is a secondary school leaver. 60% of computer users are those with post-secondary and tertiary education. In short, we think that there is an early sign of a digital divide along the line of household income, age group and educational qualifications.

Under ICT 21 Masterplan, one of our aims is to dot.com the entire people sector so that there will be no digital divide in the information society of the future. Among households without home PCs, according to our survey, 14% cited the high cost of a PC as a reason for not owning a PC. For low-income households, we need to help make ownership of home PCs more affordable to them. However, what is even more important is to help more Singaporeans to discover the usefulness of IT and Internet and to learn to use the technology. This is because among those households without PCs at home, 73% of them either do not see the need for PCs or do not know how to use a PC. Some of them also feel that they are too old to learn to use IT.

To bridge this emerging digital divide, the Government cannot do it alone. What we need is a broad-based people sector driven movement, reaching out to all the different population segments in our society. We need to rely on the joint efforts of the Government, the labour movement, the business community and the various volunteer and grassroots organisations, so as to overcome the barriers of income, language and mindset which are holding back some Singaporeans from embracing IT and Internet today.

Mr Iswaran made three suggestions yesterday. Firstly, to draw on the People's Association in reaching out to the grassroots users. Secondly, to use characters well-known to older Singaporeans, such as Liang Po Po and so on, as our IT icons and e-ambassadors. And thirdly, to take the path of least resistance, such as games and entertainment, to induce first-time computer users before they progress to something more serious. My response to Mr Iswaran's three suggestions is yes, yes and yes.

Mr Ravindran suggested that we should step up effort to promote development of Internet contents in Mandarin, Malay and Tamil. Again, my response is yes. Up till now, Internet content is very much US-centric and mainly in English. With the rapid rise in Internet users based in Europe and in Asia, we are seeing a clear trend towards the development of regional contents in regional languages. We can expect to see a rapid growth of Asian portals in Asian languages from now on. In fact, this morning, Media Corp Interactive and Popular Holdings launched a joint venture known as the Chinese 88.com. Their aim is to become a global player in the Chinese Internet portal. Likewise, our Malay and Tamil communities are promoting the development and the use of Malay Internet and Tamil Internet to keep up with the transition towards a knowledge-based economy and the information society. The Government, through the IDA, will work with these various industry players and civic organisations, such as the Malay and Tamil Internet Societies, and provide them with the necessary assistance because the proliferation of non-English Internet is probably the best way for us to attract more older Singaporeans who are more comfortable with their mother tongues rather than English.

In this regard, we will be providing assistance through the Local Industry Upgrading Programme (LIUP) and the Innovation Development Scheme (IDS) to help companies and organisations that want to go into the development of non-English contents and portals. At the same time, we will continue to step up our training of Internet in Malay and Tamil. For example, at One Learning Place in Toa Payoh, so far, 1,200 users have been trained to use Internet in Malay and 257 were trained to use Internet in Tamil and we will do more of this.

Mr Peh suggested that we should do more to reach out to the homemakers. I agree with him. In fact, we have identified homemakers as one of the five target groups. The other four are NS men, workers, senior citizens and the disabled. We will explore the use of TV as a medium to bring IT education to the homes, as suggested by Mr Peh. Meanwhile, Mr Peh may be pleased to note that IDA is running the One Learning Place in Toa Payoh to provide training on broadband Internet which is more fun and more exciting than learning Internet on TV. For the 10 months, from May 1999 to February this year, One Learning Place has reached out to more than 37,000 trainees. Among them, more than 30% are Singaporeans who are more than 40 years, including 608 of them who are more than 60 years old. Even though working adults make up the majority of the trainees at the One Learning Place, we did have 2,970 homemakers among the trainees and we hope that more will join the class as we intensify our efforts in reaching out to these five target groups in the coming years. 3.45 pm

Mdm Claire Chiang urged the Ministries to make their websites as interactive as possible and she urged the Ministry to exploit the full potential of Internet. Again, my response is yes. The public sector has been the leading users of IT since we started the Civil Service Computerisation Programme (CSCP) in 1981. The CSCP spearheaded the use of PCs and database in Singapore in the early 80s, followed by data communication and electronic data interchange (EDI) in the mid-80s, and followed by the intelligent systems and integrated office systems in the early 90s. It has also been an early adopter of Internet and Intranet in the past few years.

The next IT challenge for the civil service is to become a leading user of broadband Internet, wireless Internet and Internet appliance. With our firm foundation in IT built up over the past 20 years, we should aspire to be among the first nations in the world, if not the first, to offer a comprehensive e-Government services for the convenience of the public. We hope the day will come when members of the public can have access to Government services in a triple A manner, meaning any time, anywhere, using any device, be it the PC, Notebook, Palmtop, cellular handphone and so on.

Last, but not least, we should not forget the significant role played by the labour movement. In fact, the NTUC is today the largest provider of IT education and training in Singapore, training more than 20,000 rank-and-file workers in IT every year. It will continue to have a major role to play under the ICT 21. We believe that it is through such concerted efforts of the Government, the labour movement, the business community and grassroots organisations that we are hopeful that many Singaporeans will embrace IT and cross over to the right side of the digital divide in the coming years.

Sir, I will now move on to respond to the cut proposed by Mr Low Thia Khiang regarding IT security in the Government sector. I agree with Mr Low that, as we intensify the use of IT in the Government sector, IT security will become even more important, because it is important that we safeguard the reliability and the security of the system, as well as the information maintained in this system.

Mr Low asked three questions. Firstly, whether we have IT standards in place for the Government sector. The answer is yes. In fact, since July 1996, the former NCB, which is IDA today, formulated a comprehensive set of IT security standards. In the formulation of these standards, we benchmarked ourselves with best practice all over the world and we even have a foreign expert to advise us. Today, there is a comprehensive set of IT security standards in place for the public sector. It covers all areas of security, right from IT security policy to various specific guidelines regarding firewall and even disaster recovery, meaning that if something were to happen to our data centre, we will be able to recover and relaunch the whole system within a very short period of time.

Mr Low's second question is: are the guidelines secure enough to prevent illegal access? The answer is yes and no. The answer is yes because the guidelines, based on what we know today, in terms of the technique for illegal access, are sufficient to prevent illegal access, at least to detect them. But we must be mindful that every day there could be someone dreaming of new ways of making an illegal access. Basically, the risk is always there. Our challenge is to continue to update our security standards to make sure that the system will be as secure as possible.

Thirdly, Mr Low wants to know who is responsible to ensure that the security guidelines will be implemented and followed in the civil service. The direct agency that must be held responsible for the implementation of these standards must be the respective Ministries, because the information and the data are owned by the respective Ministries. The Ministries will therefore have direct responsibility to make sure that the security standards are being implemented, and yet at the same time, we have in place a system to do auditing. For example, every year, the Auditor-General will have a programme to audit the various Ministries. At the same time, the IT audit team from IDA goes round to audit the Ministries, and they complement the effort of the Auditor-General.

Sir, let me move on to the cut by Dr Teo Ho Pin who asked two questions. Firstly, he asked whether we can install outgoing mail boxes in all residential blocks. The answer is no. The reason is because SingPost did a study and they came to the conclusion that if they were to put an outgoing mail box in every residential block, firstly, it will be very labour intensive, meaning that they would have to employ more postmen to do the job. Secondly, what is of even greater concern to SingPost is that it will actually slow down the delivery time for local mail. Because right now under the IDA guidelines, SingPost will have to ensure 95% next day delivery for mails outside the CBD. For mails within the CBD, the standard is 98%. And their assessment is that if they were to put outgoing mail boxes in every residential block, it will actually lengthen the process and delay the delivery of mail.

The second question Dr Teo asked was whether we can relocate the mail boxes along the roads so as to reduce traffic congestion or provide parking bays for such mail boxes. Sir, the answer is yes. IDA will continue to work with SingPost and the LTA to minimise traffic congestion and relocate the post boxes to population centres, such as MRT stations, community clubs, bus interchanges and selective petrol stations.

Mr Yeo Guat Kwang: Sir, since the NTUC has committed to support and fund the training of all its 10,000 union leaders for basic IT and Internet, I would like to ask the Minister of State whether his Ministry can request the People's Association to do the same for all the grassroots leaders.

Mr Lim Swee Say: I think this is a very good suggestion. The IDA will take it up with the People's Association and see how we can implement a similar programme.

Dr Teo Ho Pin: Sir, may I ask the Minister of State what measures have been taken by the Ministry to ensure that residents can post mails conveniently?

Mr Lim Swee Say: Sir, under the licence issued by the IDA to SingPost, there is a requirement in terms of the location of the mail boxes. For example, in the population centres, for HDB estates that are more dense, the distance between any two outgoing mail boxes cannot be more than 500 metres. For the medium density blocks, it is 750 metres. For the low density blocks, it is 1 km. Within the business district, it is 250 metres. In that sense, we make sure that our residents do not have to walk too far in order to have access to a mail box.

Mr Chay Wai Chuen: Sir, I thank the Minister, the Minister of State and the Parliamentary Secretary for all the answers and I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The Chairman: Amendment No. (2). I am afraid there is only one minute left. Do you want to speak, Mr Chiam?

Mr Chiam See Tong (Potong Pasir): Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head I of the Development Estimates be reduced by $10 in respect of Code IH 5200.

Sir, I wonder whether the Minister can modify the COE system by having a cap of one-third of the price of the successful bid or strike price. If we have such a scheme, it will be a stabilising effect on COE prices. I will give an example. If the strike price is $30,000, one third of that is $10,000. And anyone bidding above $40,000 will be disqualified for that particular round, but his name can go over to the next or following bid. This will have a stabilising effect. Instead of the upward push of prices, this cap would keep prices fairly stable, and not a runaway price like the $100,000 COE price that we had some time back.

The Chairman: There are 30 seconds left, Mr Yeo.

Mr Yeo Cheow Tong: I think I should answer the Member. The studies by LTA show that the successful bids actually cluster very closely to the lowest successful bid. Using the example of $30,000, actually most of the successful bids are within that $10,000 band that the Member was talking about. This is the vast majority. This is already taking place. 3.55 pm

The Chairman: I am afraid we have reached the "guillotine" time.

Mr Chiam See Tong: I beg to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The sum of $448,959,300 for Head I ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $1,740,404,200 for Head I ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.

Head F -

The Chairman: Head F - Parliament, Mr Sinnakaruppan.

Mr R. Sinnakaruppan (Kreta Ayer-Tanglin): Sir, since there has been no such cut in the Parliament budget for many years, I will certainly try to be very careful in putting my points forward, so that I do not get cut midway through my speech, Sir.

The Chairman: Could I cut you, please? Could you move your amendment first?

Mr Sinnakaruppan: Sir, I beg to move,

That the total sum to be allocated for Head F of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100.

Sir, our new Parliament House is a new icon for all of us in Singapore. It is a new hardware that we are all very pleased and proud of. Thanks to you, Sir, as Speaker, and all those who have been involved in this development. However, I think that it is an opportune time to review the software - the Standing Orders and other related matters.

I would like to touch on a few points. First, the sitting times. The sitting time of this House should perhaps be extended from the present time in the Standing Orders of 4.30 pm to, say, 6.30 pm. The reason is that in the last 81/2 years or so that I have been in this House, I have seen, almost at every sitting day, the Leader of the House had to stand up and ask for an extension. I think it is not fair to impose it on him, and I think that we should extend it to 6.30 pm. If we finish early, he can stand up occasionally to say, "Let us adjourn." That will be a better arrangement.

Second, the notice for Oral Questions. Presently, we need to give seven days' notice, and I would like to propose that with all these Internet speeches being made, we should move to a more Internet time of maybe two or three days' notice. I know that some countries like the UK has got 10 days' notice. In the US, they hardly give any notice. They go through the committees. There are various models. For every country that we can find to say it is seven or eight days, we can find countries, which like Uganda, have three days' notice. So there is no right or wrong model, but let us look at what is suitable for us. This will make us more relevant and not dated in putting our Questions forward. When the Straits Times has come out with an article, we have to wait seven days to ask the same Question, which does not really look right and current.

I know the civil servants and, to some extent, the Frontbench have to work a little bit harder if it is two or three days' notice, but I think it is worth it for the benefit of all Singaporeans who want to get the updated position of the Government.

The other point on Question Time is that we only have one hour for Question Time. We have so many Questions. In the past, many Questions cannot be answered. Something could be done, occasionally for the Speaker or the Leader of the House to decide that we extend Question Time by another half an hour to clear most of the Questions, and this can be done with the discretion of the two gentlemen of the House.

Sir, as regards time limit for Backbenchers, you may be very, very happy, Sir. At present, we allow 30 minutes for speeches by Backbenchers. I would like to propose maybe we cut it down to 15 or 20 minutes, simply because some of us here are very tired of hearing old gramophone records of speeches and points made by some persons on such topic as lack of democracy in Singapore or lack of rule of law in Singapore, and so on. Sir, certainly, we do not want to put up with this. I do not know whether Dr Vasoo agrees with me. 4.00 pm

Dr Vasoo: Certainly.

Mr Sinnakaruppan: Certainly. I want to move on to the Committee of Supply. With many substantive issues to be discussed in this House and the number of Budget cuts increasing by the year and records being broken every year, I would like to propose something practised by Westminster, ie, to divide the House into at least two Committees. If you look at the Budget book on page 11, the financial expenditure is divided by various sectors. We have got security, social and community services, economic and infrastructural development and general services. The first two categories are really more for Defence and Home Affairs, Civil Defence, Education, Health, MCD and Sports, MITA, Environment, and so on. Infrastructural development will include many of the business areas: National Development, MCIT and so on. We can divide the House into two and find a way to organise the MPs, either they sit in one group or the other, or use our professors in the University to find out how they schedule their student programmes, where they go through various modules and combinations. I know there are expert systems that are available for universities to use, and we can use it for a few days, I am sure.

The Chairman: Mr Sinnakaruppan, can I ask you to allow time for the Minister to reply?

Mr Sinnakaruppan: Can I just be allowed two minutes more, Sir?

The Chairman: All right.

Mr Sinnakaruppan: Sir, I would like to propose that we look at this Committee model so that we can be much more efficient and at the same time give more time for speakers to put their points forward.

The other point is on the $100 cuts. Mr Chiam has put in many $10 cuts. Maybe he is following the rules very correctly, but maybe he is just putting in his name so that his name appears in many places and not be given a chance to speak because most MPs now put $100 cut. Maybe we should get away with that.

Sir, the last point is, I do not want to say anything about the Speaker's title because although he does not speak much here, the Speaker is a distinguished title that we should still keep it. It is an honorary title. But for the Clerk of Parliament, in today's context in Singapore, (Mr P O Ram is about to retire from civil service) if we try to get younger people to come, nobody would want to be the Clerk of Parliament because everybody thinks that it is a clerk's job. P. O. Ram is a senior civil servant. Many younger people will not come. Even an insurance agent is called an insurance consultant. I think we should look at all these points and perhaps call for a review of our Standing Orders by our Standing Orders Committee.

The Leader of the House (Mr Wong Kan Seng): I thank the Member for making this amendment. Since the Speaker cannot speak, I will speak on his behalf and I hope he will not cut me off at 4.05 pm. I think we follow what some people do and we also do new things on our own. I always have a dictum. We always look at what we do all the time, review them and, if it is necessary to change, we will change. But I also believe sometimes that when it ain't broke, do not fix it.

There are a few points that the Member raised. For example, the extension of Question Time by more than half an hour. I have looked up the other Parliaments and I found that practically all of them have one hour or less. In fact, in some cases, even just 30 minutes. In the case of Canada, a question cannot even be asked in more than 35 seconds and an answer cannot be given in more than 35 seconds. I do not know whether you want to get to that stage. For Question Time, I have some sympathy but for now, until we relook at the Standing Orders again, we leave it well and good.

On the point about reducing the notice period from seven days to two days, I think two days would not be fair enough for a proper answer to be given, unless he just wants an answer that says "The Ministry will look into it." That we can give it to him perhaps with one day's notice or on the spot.

Exempting the Standing Orders every time we need to go beyond 4.30 pm is not a problem at all. It is a very simple thing. I will stick to that because, if need be, we will move a motion. By his suggestion, I still have got to come up and adjourn earlier. So it makes no difference to me.

Time limit of speeches of Members to 20 minutes is a good point to consider. At the right time, we may consider that. But some may not totally agree with him because some may prefer a longer time.

On the Committee of Supply dividing into two different Committees, I think all of us want to be in the same committee. I think it is very difficult to say that my interest is only in this and not in the others because some of our interests may cross. If you look at one classification, "Economic and Infrastructural Development", Ministry of Trade and Industry and Ministry of Manpower, are very different from public housing under Ministry of National Development. So they are totally unrelated. The Ministers have a responsibility for their own portfolios and we should leave it to them to decide how to answer those questions instead of putting them into different Committees.

As for the title, I think the Clerk will not appreciate changing the title. I do not know his sentiments. This title has been in existence for more than 600 years. The first recorded term of "Clerk" was in 1363, 637 years ago. Fortunately, other Members said that the Speaker does not need to change his name. If we changed, I am sure you, Mr Speaker, will take great offence because in the whole of Singapore, no official title is called the Speaker, except yours. If we call you "President" or "Chairman", there are plenty around.

The Chairman: Mr Sinnakaruppan, seeing that I am quite happy with the way things are, do you still insist on cutting my budget? I would wisely advise you to withdraw the amendment.

Mr Sinnakaruppan: Sir, I want to correct what the Minister had said. I did not ask for a change of the Speaker's name. I only ask for a change for the Clerk of Parliament. I would like to thank the Minister and although his answer is not very encouraging, I would like to withdraw my amendment.

The Chairman: It is a wise decision.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The Chairman: I hope Members would not take this overlooking of the "guillotine" time as a precedent.

The sum of $24,021,640 for Head F ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $11,409,100 for Head F ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.

Head Q -

The Chairman: Head Q - Ministry of Home Affairs. Amendment No. (1), Mr Chng Hee Kok.

Mr Chng Hee Kok (East Coast): Sir, I beg to move,

That the total sum to be allocated for Head Q of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100.

Sir, at the height of Asia's currency crisis some 1 1/2 years ago, followed by the collapse of the Suharto Government in Indonesia, there were numerous reports of illegal entry of foreigners into Singapore and there were several subsequent busts of enclaves of illegal immigrants. Since then, the issue has abated, thanks in no small measure to our law enforcement officers, the new immigration checkpoint and also of course the recent addition to our fleet of fast patrol boats.

Sir, although the issue has abated, it is by no means over. We still have substantial numbers trying to enter Singapore illegally and right now there must be thousands in our midst even as I speak today. As long as our economy continues to grow and some other countries face economic hardship, this problem will not go away. Without proper identification records, and sometimes taken advantage of by some unscrupulous employers, it is inevitable that some of these illegals will resort to crime. Apprehending the perpetrators becomes sometimes an impossible task when a crime is committed.

I should like the Minister to give an update to this House on the situation of the illegal immigrants and overstayers. We should continue to place high priority on making sure that our borders are sealed against those entering Singapore illegally.

One must wonder the extent of the problem. For every successful apprehension of smuggling of illegal immigrant, there must be a number who have got away scot free. We read in the newspapers that everyone who has been caught has admitted to doing it more than once.

Besides depending on the Home Team for enforcement, we must also do more by way of public education. In an urbanised country like Singapore, there must be several instances of Singaporeans who are aware or suspicious of foreigners living in their midst who may be illegal immigrants, yet they do not come forward.

I think it is shocking indeed to read a New Paper report of 4th March headlined "120 workers in one flat". There was a 6-room flat in Serangoon which housed some 120 foreign workers. The report highlighted the horrendous living conditions of these 120 foreign workers and it took five months for someone to alert the police and report anonymously. Although not proven yet that there are illegal immigrants in this group, this is an ideal situation for harbouring illegal immigrants. Sir, we must step up public education that illegal immigrants are a threat to our well-being and security and it is also the public's duty to be on the lookout.

Will the Minister consider further measures to encourage the public to be more proactive in seeking out illegal immigrants?

Assoc. Prof. Chin Tet Yung: Sir, the Minister informed the House last year that the Home Team arrested about 23,000 immigration offenders in 1998, which was a 65% increase over the 14,000 arrested in 1997. This increased arrest, of course, came at a time when the region's economies were not doing well. As such, it was logical to expect that people from the not-so-well developed countries come and flock illegally to countries that have weathered the crisis well. Singapore was one of these countries. However, the situation has changed. Singapore and the regional economies have begun to recover.

Sir, I am concerned that Singaporeans may now have the perception that we no longer have an immigration offender problem. I wonder whether the Minister can update us on the current immigration offender situation in Singapore. I think we cannot afford to be lax in our enforcement efforts against immigration offenders. We are not out of the woods yet and cannot afford to let our guards down. We should particularly target those who trade in illegal immigrants, smuggle them in or who are traffickers. Perhaps we should see how we can increase penalties to deter them from pursuing such trades.

Mr Kenneth Chen Koon Lap (Hong Kah): Sir, the immigration law in Singapore is very stringent. It has to be because of the size of our country. However, due to the problem that we encounter with the slowing down of our population growth and the importance of attracting foreign talents, we have accepted more immigrants in recent years to fulfil our objective. Otherwise the rigidity of the immigration rule is still intact. One such rule governs the return of single parents and their offsprings. The rules state that the children of single parents, father or mother, who return to Singapore cannot be automatically granted PR unless his or her single parents can prove that they are gainfully employed. However, many Singaporean women especially, who married foreigners and who failed in their marriage and having gained the custody of their children, find it difficult to obtain PRs for them because they may not be able to secure a job due to educational level or many other reasons that are out of their control.

The dilemma faced by these single parents is that their ties have been severed by their former spouses and they have no alternative place to settle but back to Singapore where at least they have the support of their immediate families. Perhaps the Ministry should be more compassionate in the ruling towards these cases as, first, the number of these cases must be quite insignificant. Secondly, at least the child has cultural and social ties with the immediate families. Thirdly, it seems to be quite hard that as Singapore citizens their offspring cannot be considered favourably to be PR. Worse still, in case something happens to them, their offspring cannot stay in Singapore to be looked after by their immediate families but have to be repatriated to the country where they are its citizen, they will have no connection whatsoever by now and their spouses may have remarried or moved to other places and cannot be located.

Assoc. Prof. Chin Tet Yung: Sir, this House has heard in the past few days of debate many calls for civil servants to be proactive, accountable and transparent. I echo the need for civil servants to have all these attributes and would like to focus on the Singapore Immigration and Registration Department today. 4.15 pm

SIR plays a key role in regulating the number of people entering and staying in Singapore. It also has a role to play in determining who should or should not be citizens or permanent residents. It shares a responsibility with the Ministry of Manpower in relation to maids, foreign workers and the like, who are on work passes.

Sir, I am sure that many Members of this House are asked to help applicants to the SIR. Whether it be an application for long-term social pass, dependant's pass, or the extension of such passes, or the application for permanent residence or citizenship, we are continually at a loss as to why a case is rejected or a decision postponed. Usually there is a brief message saying that the application has been unsuccessful. Within a day of receiving the letter, the unsuccessful applicant is back in the meet-the-people session asking the MP to write another letter. Huge amount of paper work is generated by this process, let alone the man-hours spent in having to answer what must be a mountain of letters every week from Members.

Sir, the applicants to all these various forms of passes are continuously puzzled by the rejection. They inevitably have stories to tell - their neighbours or their co-workers were successful on similar facts, and so on. I should like to suggest that SIR be more precise in their letters. The best, of course, is to give a reason or reasons for their decision. That would give invaluable guidance to the applicant and he or she would be informed as to how he or she can improve their chances of getting the appropriate pass. If the policy is somehow veiled in secrecy, the official letters should state how long the applicant should wait before his or her case gets reviewed again. The MP could perhaps be separately informed about the problem in the case. But I naturally hope that this would be more the exception than the rule.

Sir, many Singaporeans who are applying on behalf of their spouses or family members frequently come frustrated and angry at the seemingly mysterious rejection of their applications. And they get even more frustrated and angry when the MP could not lift the veil of mystery. I believe it is time that SIR must be clearer in their communication of their decisions to those who are applying and their sponsors. Very often these decisions affect the happiness or otherwise of the families concerned. At least they should be entitled to know why their applications are turned down. I hope the Minister can elaborate on this matter.

Mr Chng Hee Kok: Sir, the Singapore Police Force Public Perception Survey last year and a similar survey done by the Straits Times should make us proud of the Home Team.

The conclusions are similar: in the Straits Times survey, some 99% of the Singaporeans found this country a safe place to live in; and the Police survey, 95.8% of the respondents rated the general security of Singapore to be good or excellent. The public's perception of safety in Singapore perhaps stems from the fact that Singapore has seen a decline in crime rate over the past 10 years. In 1999, the Police had less than 3,500 cases recorded per month, compared to an average of some 4,000 cases per month in 1998. It is heartening to see that almost all major categories of crimes have declined. As a result, people feel safe walking through a stretch of deserted road from the bus-stop to their homes.

Sir, the image of a safe and secure Singapore has done our economy much good. Many investors see Singapore as a place where they can do business smoothly, efficiently and safely. Thus, it is no surprise that many multi-national companies see Singapore as an ideal business hub.

We should not however take the situation for granted. If the standard of our law enforcing agencies should go into decline, there is no turning back the clock. After years of being perceived as a law and order country, today, Japan is plagued by a series of scandals in the police force and public perception of the level of security has dropped.

A good public perception of the Police is a hard-earned one. To ensure that we maintain this high standard, we must continue the high standard of training and reward our officers well. In the area of training, we must also improve the training of officers handling the public as only some 64% of the Straits Times survey rated the service of the Police to be good or very good. It could be that poor public relations is the cause of this perception. It may be that good crime busters may not be the best public relations persons, but we have to try. Besides an improvement in training, we must also improve the reward system so that acts of exemplary conduct be well rewarded and recognised.

Perhaps the Minister can highlight to the House how we can continue to keep our Home Team in tip-top shape.

Mr Goh Choon Kang (Marine Parade): (In Mandarin): Sir, on 24th January this year, the Lianhe Zaobao shows a big caption that public confidence in the Police in Singapore has declined. It gave me a shock. Do not tell me that the public has lost its confidence in our Police Force. This is not true. This caption was very misleading. If we had not carefully read the contents of the article, the readers would easily get the wrong impression. Therefore, I feel that the media should be more careful in dealing with this type of news. Because public confidence in the Police is closely linked to public order, law and discipline of our country. So the media has the responsibility to avoid unnecessarily and wrongly tarnishing the image of the Police.

The sub-caption of this news was that more members of the public feel that the Police has been effective in maintaining public order in Singapore. But this was the main finding of the survey in 1999. Actually, there is a great contradiction between the two captions. If more people feel that the Police is effective in maintaining public order, then their confidence in the Police should be increasing, instead of declining.

The 1999 Singapore Police Force Public Perception Survey, as compared to the survey in 1996, shows that there are more people who feel that the perception of the Police has improved. More people feel that the Police has been effective in maintaining public order and that the Police has given them adequate protection, and are more professional. They are able to solve crime cases in a better manner. They will do their best to go after the criminals, quick in response, and effectively enforcing traffic laws, etc. The general overall impression of this survey is that the vast majority of the people feel that public order in Singapore is very good.

Over the past three years, there have not been great changes. As we all know, in 1997 and 1998, many countries in this region suffered from the financial crisis and many of them had great political and social unrest, and we could not help being affected, particularly when there were a lot of illegal immigrants coming here. It cannot be denied that there were some cases where Police officers were charged with corruption and they had tarnished the clean image of the Police Force. But the fact that the Police Force has effectively discovered and dealt with these black sheep among them also illustrates that the Police Force itself is determined to safeguard its noble image.

For the maintenance of public order, the Police's deterrent effect is crucial. The deterrent effect of the Police Force, to a great extent, depends on its professionalism and effectiveness in solving cases. In this respect, it is like paddling a canoe against the current. If you do not go ahead, you will go backwards. Therefore, the Police should work harder to further improve itself.

Now, with the society getting more and more sophisticated, the Police has to face greater challenges in dealing with the criminals and in the investigation of the various types of crimes. The social public order cannot depend on the Police alone. The public should also play a very important role to cooperate with the Police. Therefore, I will take this opportunity to urge members of the public to actively participate in the Community Safety and Security Programme launched by the Police Force, so as to contribute towards the overall social security.

Mr S. Iswaran (West Coast): Sir, if I can take it where Mr Chng and Mr Goh have left. It appears from time to time that there is a disjoint between the public perception of the Police Force and the general crime situation on the one hand and the actual state of affairs on the other.

If you look at the facts, the Police Force has come a long way in terms of professionalism, in terms of the quality of its manpower and in terms of the general crime situation. Yet, the Police Force comes in for an unfair criticism or a bum rap, as some would say it from time to time. Why is that so? There appear to be several contributory factors. One is occasional media reporting; the other is personal experiences.

If I can elaborate, although the general statistics on crime have been improving, occasional crime occurrences, such as some recent ones in Bukit Batok, loom large in the public psyche and fundamentally affect their sense of security. Secondly, personal experiences with the Police. Although, in general, one might be pleased with the state of affairs, a particular episode with an individual officer may leave one with a different impression. And thirdly, a few bad apples in the Force may also give the entire Police Force an unfairly bad image. These occasional episodes can affect adversely the general sense of security and therefore public perception of the Police Force. And this may also hinder public cooperation with the Police's efforts, which I think is fundamental for the success of the Police's efforts.

Sir, I would like to ask the Minister what is being done to maintain and enhance the Police Force's standing in the public eye. The Police Force, like any other organisation, public or private, needs strong public relations because it must do a good job and it must be seen to be doing a good job.

In that regard, I would like to know whether the Ministry and the Police Force, in particular, has a PR programme in general with the national level, in order to maintain and sustain the public's confidence and sense of appreciation for the Police Force. Second, whether there are specific programmes that can be put in place in the aftermath of particularly dramatic incidents, so that people in the neighbourhood can rest assured and their confidence can be restored quickly. And, third, what programmes there are at the individual level for particular officers to be trained in order to deal with the general public and also with grassroots leaders?

Mr Sin Boon Ann (Tampines): Sir, the recent spate of high profile prosecution of corrupt officers from the Singapore Police Force, the Civil Defence and the Singapore Immigration Department (collectively called the "Home Team") has caused much concern and dismay to Singaporeans. The prosecutions would appear to have had the effect of undermining public confidence in the integrity of the Home Team. Needless to say, Singaporeans take great pride in the fact that our society is relatively free from corruption. The fact that these cases have now come out to light is a matter of concern indeed.

Sir, there are many Singaporeans who continue to express these concerns, even though a recent report from a survey commissioned by the Police Force and published in the Straits Times revealed that most Singaporeans believe that the Singapore Police Force is doing a good job in keeping the country safe and that the Police are respectable, approachable, well-trained, disciplined and capable.

Such reaction is only natural, as the public has rightly come to expect the highest level of integrity and honesty from the people whom they have placed their trust and confidence in to look after their safety and security.

However, even though their concern is natural, it is not the only way to react to the recent publicity. On the other hand, the publicity may be seen from a different perspective. One way of looking at this is that the prosecution of corrupt officers shows that we do not cover up such cases. In fact, Singaporeans should take comfort in the knowledge that the Government goes all out to prosecute errant officers of whatever rank. And indeed, those tempted to follow the footsteps of the errant officers would know that far from providing any protection against detection and punishment, the Home Team and in particular the Police Force, is ever more determined to keep its own house in order.

The statistics given by the Straits Times as to the exact number of errant officers who were caught and prosecuted in recent years have shown a rising trend. Statistics, however, Sir, must be read in context. The figures must be seen in the light of the total composition of the Home Team. Compared to previous years, the Police Force is now 7,500 strong. If out of the 7,500 police officers, only 35 have been prosecuted as of September 1999, the figure seems quite minuscule indeed. We must bear in mind that there is an overwhelming number of officers from the Home Team who maintain the highest standard of conduct and decorum. To pass poor judgment on the Home Team would be manifestly unfair to the others who have served the country faithfully. 4.30 pm

One question is whether those who were caught and prosecuted only represent the tip of the iceberg. Sir, I do not think so. Since last year, we note that the police have put in place a series of measures to ensure that the integrity of the Home Team is maintained. These measures include job rotation, zero tolerance for corruption, psychological screening and emotional and financial help for police officers in need.

Over and above such measures put in place by the Police Force, I would like to ask the Minister whether the Government would consider it necessary to prescribe heavier penalties in law for police officers who have broken the trust of the public by engaging in corrupt practices. What this means is that the law specifies special penalties on such officers as opposed to leaving it to the discretion of the judge as a matter of sentencing policy. This is important as it sends a clear signal to members of the public on the seriousness with which we treat such breaches.

Sir, police officers are not ordinary civil servants. Together with members of the Home Team, they are entrusted by the members of the public to protect life and property and to uphold the law. The Home Team has a very high and onerous duty. A breach of the trust that the public placed on them is very serious indeed. Accordingly, the punishment must also be considerably higher than the rest of society. With more severe penalties, it would perhaps add as another deterrent to discourage police officers from even thinking of stepping in the direction of errant ways.

Mr Chng Hee Kok: Sir, the objective of the Community Safety and Security Programme (CSSP) is to encourage communities to take active responsibility in solving safety and security problems at the local level, supported by the Home Team. Sir, the approach in implementing the CSSP so far is to mobilise the community through grassroots leaders in the CDCs, CCCs, RCs and neighbourhood committees. These grassroots leaders have been instrumental in crafting CSSP in reaching out to the residents and encouraging them to participate in their activities. Although an integral part of the community, schools have largely been operating outside the CSSP framework.

Sir, there are a number of benefits for us to send the CSSP to the schools. These are (1) the focus in dealing with safety and security concerns. Sir, different schools have a different safety and security profile. The CSSP allows every school to tailor-make measures to zero in on the most present safety and security problems. For example, some of the CSSP activities may include the refinements to the school's conduct of fire drills, with the assistance of the SCDF, implementing a scheme to enrol students in policing busy roads and junctions leading to the schools, etc. This will ensure that our traffic safety rules are observed during school assembly and dismissal hours. (2) Working out programmes to address the issue of delinquency in school children loitering in our void decks. The main point is that there is a single point of contact for schools. Schools currently conduct individual Home Team contact, individual Home Team department to seek advice in systems, in areas, such as crime prevention, fire safety, drug abuse, prison visits, and so on.

With the CSSP framework in place, schools can work with the Home Team on all safety and security issues through a single point of contact represented by the Police. I think this arrangement will also help to reduce inconvenience workload of the schools. It will also allow the Home Team to have a better understanding with the school's overall safety and security problem and thereby enable the Home Team to coordinate joint assistance programmes to effectively improve the safety and security vision of the schools.

Lastly, Sir, inculcating community spirit. Through the CSSP, the school can educate our students on the community's role in resolving safety and security issues by roping in students to participate in the CSSP activities. Students learn the concept of community self-help and they need to take up responsibility to look after the community. Sir, it is timely that we do more work and take some comprehensive steps to bring the schools to win the CSSP. Would the Minister highlight to the House what are the plans in this area?

Mr Iswaran: Sir, CSSP has been in force for some time now. I would like to ask the Minister what the progress has been, in particular, what the response has been from the grassroots organisations who have been approached to participate in the programme. In particular, I would like to know whether the Ministry adjudges the programme to have been a success so far and how it has measured the success of this programme.

Secondly, as Mr Chng has highlighted, the question is whether we can build on this platform and extend the CSSP to other organisations or other areas of concern, and the schools are a logical extension in this respect. However, my concern is also that, if a school participates in a CSSP programme, does it risk attracting an audience that is involved because of a problem, or that it is rife with a crime or criminal elements rather than the fact that it is proactive and forthcoming to participate in this activity. So I would ask the Minister to explain how such programmes, if they intend to be extended to the schools and other agencies, will be done and what criteria and perhaps, more importantly, how the right message can be communicated that this participation is proactive and not because there are problems rife within the organisation.

Finally, Sir, with this general effort to involve the community in policing and in the maintenance and enhancement of general security in our communities, the question that is often asked is whether this augments or whether it replaces or is a substitute for activities by the Police on the ground, in particular, patrolling and the manning levels at neighbourhood police posts, etc. So I would like the Minister's assurance that indeed, the CSSP is to complement the existing police activity on the ground and that it does not lead to any scaling back of such activity.

Mr Peh Chin Hua: (In Mandarin): Sir, the speed in which the Singapore police officers solve cases is well known to all. For example, they have done very well in arresting the kidnappers, secret society members and robbers. This is very heartening. However, recently, I heard some comments from ordinary citizens in Singapore that when the police arrested the illegal workers and loansharks at the coffeeshops and hawker centres, they could only arrest the "tua pek kong" but not the "heads". At first, I did not understand what they meant by tua pek kong. Later on, I found out that the ordinary citizens were referring to the runners. They cannot get hold of the syndicate leaders, but managed only to arrest the runners who were really the scapegoats.

I personally feel that with the wisdom, experience and efficiency of the senior-ranking police officers, they need just to spend a little more time and effort. And they would be able to catch hold of these syndicate leaders and not just these runners to be the scapegoats. Otherwise, if our policemen can only nab these runners, while the syndicate leaders stay at the back and laugh at the police for their incapability, it will be an insult to the entire police force. From what I know, even after these runners were arrested and sent to prison, the gang would continue to collect the protection money, which could be as high as $500 per month from the hawkers. But of course, the syndicate leaders will look after the runners and every month, they will pay money to family members of these runners to support them. What I am worried is that if the police is not able to catch hold of the syndicate leaders, then we would not be able to eradicate these criminal activities.

Mr Goh Choon Kang: (In Mandarin): Sir, foreign workers and domestic maids come from different countries with different language, religious and cultural backgrounds. Although statistics reveal that there are cases involving foreign workers, it is fortunately not on an upward trend. But the number of cases involving foreign domestic maids seems to be going up and recently, in the media, we read the report of various types of cases like rape, outraging of modesty, abuse, theft, etc. So the impression given to us is that cases involving foreign domestic maids are on the upward trend. Perhaps, their cases may be more complicated than the cases involving our local citizens and the investigating officers will require some specialist skills for that. Some people feel that the police should have a special unit to deal with such cases and the new crime situation. I do not know whether the Minister would consider setting up such a special unit.

The Minister for Home Affairs (Mr Wong Kan Seng): I thank the Members for raising their points. Let me deal with a few of the cuts and then I will ask my Minister of State to answer the others.

On the question of the illegal immigrant situation, raised by Mr Chng Hng Kok and Prof. Chin, let me report to this House that in 1999, the Home Team arrested about 17,000 immigration offenders. By "immigration offenders" we mean illegal immigrants and overstayers, people who have overstayed in Singapore, overstayed beyond the period stated in their visit passes. This figure of 17,000 is actually a decrease of about 26% of the 1998's figure of 23,000. But this figure is still much higher, about 21% higher than the 14,000 immigration offenders arrested in 1997. The immigration offenders arrested in 1999 came from all over the region - Bangladesh, China, India, Indonesia, Myanmar and Thailand.

The number of illegal immigrants arrested in 1999, ie, those who sneak into Singapore either by car, boat, or whatever means, was about 11,500. This is a 22% decrease from the 14,800 compared to 1998. But it is still 51% more than the 7,600 arrested in 1997 and I consider this a very unacceptably high figure. As for the overstayers, 5,400 of them were arrested in 1999 and this is also a decrease of 35% from the 8,300 overstayers arrested in 1998 and a further decrease of 14% from the 1997's figure of 6,300.

Sir, to ensure that the immigration offender problem remains in check, the Home Team has taken a multi-pronged approach to deal with this problem comprehensively. For example, we have enhanced our border control. We have continued with intensive enforcement efforts against the traffickers, the employers as well as the harbourers. Police and Immigration have also conducted raids in areas where immigration offenders are likely to gather to work or live. Let me elaborate on this.

In the past year, the Police and the Singapore Immigration and Registration raided various immigration offender haunts, including construction sites, workplaces, forested areas and known congregation areas. The Police conducted 15 major island-wide operations throughout 1999, resulting in the arrest of 1,400 illegal immigrants and 185 overstayers. In addition, 17 operations were conducted in the forested areas, with 195 illegal immigrants and 27 overstayers arrested. 4.45 pm

The Police also targeted the employers of immigration offenders and the harbourers at their residential premises, such as our HDB flats and also in private estates. Since we stepped up enforcement in early 1998, it is now more difficult to find congregations of immigration offenders at any particular location. The Police has therefore widened its net to include entertainment outlets in the crackdown on immigration offenders. For example, in October last year, 100 immigration offenders were arrested in a discotheque in Orchard Road.

Sir, the Police Coast Guard has stepped up both sea and shore patrols to detect those who attempt to enter Singapore illegally by sea. The Police Coast Guard also deploys monitoring posts equipped with surveillance equipment and systems at strategic locations to detect these illegal landings. The Police Coast Guard's enhanced presence has thwarted many illegal immigration attempts. In 1999, the Police Coast Guard foiled 52 attempts and arrested close to 240 illegal immigrants. To stay on top in its fight against immigration offenders and the smugglers, the Police Coast Guard recently added 20 high speed patrol boats equipped with the latest surveillance and digital communication equipment and six highly manouverable speedboats or interceptor speedboats to its fleet. Illegal immigrants and traffickers who try to sneak in by sea will therefore be up against these high performance boats. The Police Coast Guard will continue to upgrade its fleet to ensure that it is sufficiently equipped to handle the threats and the challenges it faces.

In July last year, the new Woodlands Checkpoint or land checkpoint came into operation. To address Mr Chng's question, the facilities at this new Woodlands Checkpoint have enabled the immigration to conduct more stringent checks on the people who come in, to prevent illegal entry and departure through the land checkpoints, without adversely affecting traffic flow, because if it starts to check everybody, then I am sure people will complain that there are long queues of vehicles and long lines of people queuing at our immigration counters.

Police and the immigration also intensified the intelligence gathering to curb the trafficking of immigration offenders through the land checkpoints and these efforts have yielded positive results. For example, 60 illegal immigrant traffickers were arrested and 52 vehicles seized in 1999, compared to only 42 illegal immigrant traffickers arrested and 23 vehicles seized in the year 1998. Many of these illegal immigrants who were arrested were trying to enter Singapore or leave Singapore by concealing themselves in the car boots or in special compartments of travel coaches, lorries or bus kilangs. The media have highlighted some enforcement successes. In a widely reported case last year, SIR arrested 35 illegal immigrants who tried to sneak into Singapore on the 30th of July, which was the very last day when our old checkpoint was in operation. They were all in a lorry under the canvas sheet and mattresses. This tragic case resulted in four of the illegal immigrants dying of suffocation. This case clearly shows the ruthless nature of the traffickers of these immigration offenders. They will go to no end just to earn a quick dollar without caring for the safety of the people in the vehicle.

Police and immigration are also now focusing on crippling the syndicates that are responsible for trafficking these immigration offenders and giving these offenders forged documents. With the stringent checks in place, the syndicates have been finding new ways to send these illegal immigrants through the land checkpoints. From using lorries and buses or hiding in car boots, the syndicates are now resorting to using special compartments in the vehicles or ferrying these illegal immigrants by car or lorry to somewhere near the checkpoint and then ask these illegal immigrants to find their own way into Singapore, or out of Singapore. Such action by the syndicates is a sign of their desperation, in view of the stringent checks and enforcement by the authorities. The evolving nature of the problem means that the Home Team has to be alert and stay on top of the problem and be responsive to the new methods of operation of these syndicates. We will seek deterrent sentences against these syndicate members who are arrested.

But the responsibility for tackling the immigration offender problem does not just lie with the Home Team alone. The public, too, has a role to play. Singaporeans should not create the demand for immigration offenders by employing them. That is very important. And neither should Singaporeans harbour them by renting out their premises, flats, private apartments or houses to them. In 1999, 388 employers were arrested, compared to 270 arrested in 1998 for hiring these immigration offenders. 306 harbourers were also arrested last year compared to 166 in 1998. All these were because of stepped-up enforcement by Police and immigration.

Home-owners with premises to let out should be more careful when selecting their prospective tenants, because many of these home-owners claimed that they did not check this or that, or they simply checked the copy without looking at the original copy. What they should do is to check the prospective tenants' original copy of the immigration and work passes and then cross-check to make sure that the particulars on the passports tally with those of the work passes. In addition, where the names of the employers appear on the work passes, then the home-owners should also check with the employers to verify that the prospective tenants are indeed employed by these employers. If not, they will find themselves in great difficulty explaining to the court. If the home-owners are in doubt of the genuineness of the pass or about the status of the person, or even about his work status, then, they should contact the immigration authorities during office hours or check with the information and services counters of the Work Permit Department of the Manpower Ministry to verify the genuineness or the authenticity of these passes.

After we amended the law, all work permit holders or foreign workers must carry their work permits with them all the time. So there is no reason why foreign worker would not be able to produce the original copy of their work permits on demand. Landlords should be suspicious if their prospective tenants say that their employer kept the original and that they have only a photocopy, or that their passports are with the employer and they have only a photocopy. When they receive such papers, they should question and insist on seeing the original copies. A home-owner may lose his HDB flat, if he or his spouse or any authorised occupier of the flat has been convicted of harbouring immigration offenders. 14 such errant owners had their flats re-possessed between 1st January 1995 and 31st October 1999. So be careful.

A fundamental point I wish to make here is that, like our Members who have suggested, Singaporeans should take an interest in their own safety and security and the public should report any suspected immigration offender as well as harbourers and employers of such immigration offenders. I am told by the Director of Singapore Immigration that there was a recent instance where a member of the public came forward to report a suspected immigration offender who had produced a forged blue identity card. The member of the public saw the forged blue identity card and he suspected that something was not quite right. He called the SIR to look at that identity card and SIR confirmed that that foreigner was, in fact, an immigration offender. Such public spiritedness is to be encouraged. This will further deter anyone who wants to employ or harbour such immigration offenders and in the end, these immigration offenders will find that they have no place to live, work or hide.

On the case brought up by Mr Chng of the 120 persons found living in a boarding house in Serangoon Road, I had followed up and checked it out, and I was told that all of them are here with work passes. So they have work permits. But the owner of the property has misused his property. He did not have the permission of the proper authority and I believe URA or BCA has taken action, and so has the Civil Defence Force.

Now let me also talk about the Immigration Act which deals with immigration offenders. We have reviewed the Immigration Act quite a few times already to make sure that it is effective in dealing with this problem and now the Ministry is reviewing the Immigration Act based on operational experience to ensure that this piece of legislation continues to remain effective. For example, we are considering introducing new provisions to ensure that the housing agents also play their part in curbing the immigration offender problem. To deter the harbouring of immigration offenders, the current Immigration Act imposes due diligence on the person letting out the accommodation to check and make sure that the prospective tenants are not immigration offenders. But my Ministry will now consider extending this legal requirement for due diligence by the landlords to those who act as facilitators or middlemen in a transaction to rent out the premises as well. But this new provision will not absolve or reduce the home-owners and landlords to conduct due diligence checks as well.

Several of my colleagues spoke on the public perception of the police force and Mr Goh Choon Kang specifically referred to the headline in the press report in Lianhe Zaobao and he also explained that the second headline better explains the public perception of the Police Force. Let me say that I am the first person to be concerned about the public perception of the Police Force because, if the public has a poor impression of the police force, I think it will make it very difficult for the Police to operate in this environment. They cannot recruit people to join them because it is a lousy outfit or people think it is a lousy outfit and they cannot do their job well because the public would not cooperate with it. But we must look at the problem that is currently highlighted or reported in the press in perspective, in the total context of the Police Force. From what you read in the papers and what you read about other countries like in the United States, whether it is in New York or Los Angeles, or whether it is in Japan or in Britain, I think the problems we face pale in significance. But still, I am concerned because any black sheep that we have will cast a black mark on the whole force and will make it difficult for us.

Let us look at the survey mentioned by Mr Goh Choon Kang first. Generally, the survey has been positive and many of the positive points have been highlighted. This survey was done by a private survey agency, Forbes Research, and it was commissioned by the Police Force. That survey was also reinforced by the results of the Straits Times survey. The significant attributes of the survey were that 90% of the people surveyed felt that the Police is effective in maintaining law and order, and this is an increase of 6% over the previous survey. 78% of the people surveyed found the Police is rational in discharging their duties, and this is also an increase of 5% over the previous survey. 82% found that the Police has done well in solving crimes, and this is also an increase of 3% compared to the previous survey. 76% felt that the Police provides high quality service, and this is also an improvement of 7% over the previous survey. When the respondents were asked to select five out of the 13 statements, whether they are positive statements or negative statements of the Police, the five top attributes or descriptive terms of the Police were that they are respectable, approachable, well-trained, disciplined and capable. So, the public perception of the Police is still generally positive. The fact that the public is willing to come forward and help the Police in solving a number of crimes is testimony to the public's confidence in the Police Force, that Police will act when they make a report. In the instance of snatch theft, motor vehicle theft, robbery, housebreaking, outraging of modesty, murder and rape, 45% of the arrests of people who committed these offences were the result of public cooperation.

5.00 pm

The drop referred to in the headlines in Zaobao was in response to respectability, and reliability and trustworthiness, both registering falls to 77%, down by 6% for respectability; and for reliability and trustworthiness, down 4%, at 57% compared to the previous survey. But these reductions, I believe, were due to the recent spate of reports of Police corruption in one major case - the Ah Long San case. But one must not let this one case mar the whole perception and whole performance of the Police Force.

Put in context, more than 99.9% of our Police Force officers conduct themselves well. Less than 0.1% of the Police Force officers are charged in court every year. I think we must look at the numbers in perspective. And the Police is serious in weeding out all these errant officers whenever they are found, and although the Police knew that it would attract adverse publicity, it does not hesitate to take these officers to court, even though it may attract adverse publicity against the Police.

As regards Mr Sin Boon Ann's suggestion to raise the penalty for Police officers who commit criminal offences such as corruption, yes, I will take note of his suggestion. For now, I believe the courts have enough discretion to impose the maximum penalty.

Mr Chng asked how does the Police make sure that it keeps up its image and the performance of its officers. Training is the key, as Mr Chng himself has said, and supervision and management. There are various measures that the Police has put in place to ensure that its officers continue to remain on top of the job. Basic training is definitely a must, and they take a multi-pronged approach in training, inculcating the right values, competencies in discharging their duties, and they also do psychological tests. In other words, before people are recruited, our Police Psychological Unit actually interviews them and, as far as possible, try to sieve out those who are not suitable for the Police Force.

There is also continuous training on the job, and the training for the supervisors who, I believe, are the most important people in making sure that the officers under their charge do the job properly. Because without good managers, without good supervision, then I think something will give. So it is important that we also train our Police managers well.

On Mr Iswaran's concern about the public sense of safety, let me assure him that generally the public still feel very safe. Otherwise, the results of the survey will not hear this out. But the question he also raises is: do we have a good PR strategy to deal with these problems that crop up from time to time? The Police meets the press very regularly. It briefs them on the major cases. It briefs them on how it handles its cases. And I think the public know from these cases and the handling of the cases and the speed in which the Police solves some of the problems and the cases show the Police has been quite proactive in engaging the media and in sharing with them as much information as possible. But sometimes the Police cannot tell the press everything because some of these are operational trade secrets. We also do not want the people on the wrong side of the law to learn about them and find new ways of beating us. So, sometimes we have to reserve a bit of our position and not tell everything. But as far as possible, the Police tries to manage it and get to the public and tell them as much as they can. By informing the public about what is going on, even by reporting the crimes that are committed, it also serves a purpose to remind the public that although we have a low crime rate in Singapore, it does not mean that there is no crime. So please take the necessary precautions. So, highlighting all these cases is not at all bad, but sometimes we have to hold back some of the information, or even have to ask the press to cooperate not to release the information, as it may jeopardise a case.

Last year's kidnapping case is a good example. I know that some journalists got wind of that and, fortunately, they cooperated and did not put out the story. Otherwise, I think the Police operation to catch the culprits would have been in jeopardy. It is only after the culprits were arrested that the story came out. I think that is the way we should manage all these cases. I suppose if you have read about cases in Taiwan, I think the press got to know more than the police, and I do not think that helps the victim at all in solving his or her problem. That is the kind of approach that we want to take. But, of course, I would say also that we can be a bit more proactive and we can find new ways of marketing ourselves. And I have always told my officers that while they may have a good story, a good product, if they have not told people about how and why they do it, then I think they have not won the public over. It is not that we want to brag about what we do and gain credos and applause, but really if we have done something good, I think the public ought to know it, so that they know that the Police is actually working hard for them.

Let me assure Mr Iswaran that we take safety and security very seriously. But I also want to stress that safety and security is not just the job of the Police Force, or the job of the Home Team only. In fact, the idea that we are trying to propagate is that every one of us living in our community, living in our HDB flats and private estates, actually has a role to play in ensuring that the place remains a safe and secure one for us. So this programme called the Community Safety and Security Programme is one such programme that we put out to engage the community. It is not a programme to pass responsibility to the community, as some would like to believe. The Police will carry on doing its job, so will CNB, Immigration, Civil Defence and all the other departments. But if the residents themselves do not play a role, because they are the ones on the ground who know exactly what goes on, and if they do not play a role in helping to ensure that the place is safe and secure, then it is very difficult for the Police to be there all the time. It is impossible for the Police to be everywhere.

This Community Safety and Security Programme, which Mr Goh Choon Kang also said that we should promote and encourage, is indeed something that we ought to do. Since the programme was launched in October 1997, we have, to date,

450 Community Safety and Security Programmes already drawn up by the various committees - RCs, neighbourhood committees, and they are doing it even in private estates. I think this is quite encouraging. The fact that individuals and parents are coming forward, eg, to make sure that the zone around the school is safe for the children, is a good sign. But I think more should be done, not just keeping this programme only within the grassroots committees or only within certain concerned citizens, but all residents who want to make sure that their place is safe and secure should play a role. I think that is the only way for us to drive out the would-be criminals.

At the national level, in fact, I take a deep interest in this because wearing both hats in the People's Association and the Police, I think there is a lot of synergy to be derived between the community organisations and what the Police, the Civil Defence and the CNB want to do. It is not just using the vehicle of the grassroots organisations, but because the People's Association is also an organisation that helps to promote community bonding, cohesiveness and self-help among the community. We thought that this is really a practical example of active citizenship. We talk about Singapore 21 and active citizenship, and I think this is a concrete example of what active citizens can do for themselves, for self-interest.

As regards the suggestion to extend this programme to schools, we are already thinking about that, but I want to tread a bit cautiously here. Because some may feel, like Mr Iswaran said, that the schools may attract the odium that they have a problem. Let me assure them that this is not the case to highlight a problem in the school, but really to encourage the school community to also care for their own safety and security, within their own neighbourhood. And the students will also, in a way, be involved with the community, not just within the school itself, but also the neighbourhood around them. But we can work with the school, with the parents, teachers and the students, whether it is on juvenile delinquency, street gangs or bullies and so on. I think it is good that they themselves play a role in identifying and finding solutions to solve these problems. And the Home Team will give them the necessary support.

I want to tread cautiously here because some teachers may not fully understand this now. Some principals may wonder whether we are giving them more work. So we have taken the first step to brief the cluster supervisors. Let them understand it. Then we are going to have a meeting with some principals so that they can understand what it is all about, and those who are willing can experiment on this, just as we did on the anti-drug campaign. We have got all the schools involved in preventive drug education now, and no school is saying that just because it has got an anti-drug campaign or it has a group of people coming to talk to its students on drugs or drug prevention, the school has got a drug problem. I think that kind of perception is no longer so visible any more. I want to take CSSP one step closer to the schools but, at the same time, I will move it at a pace that the schools are comfortable with. The CSSP is really a project to complement the community with all the Home Team departments, including the Civil Defence.

This system of working together with police posts, working together with the police centre, is certainly an improvement over the normal community policing concept that we have implemented for quite some time. We have now moved from NPP to NPC in two of our Police Divisions. The NPC will, since Mr Iswaran asked, let me say to him and all of us here, actually provide more time for the Police officers to do patrols on the ground, because the NPCs can deploy their resources better. The results in the two NPCs have shown that the crime rate is actually lower, and Police time for patrols has actually increased, and the residents are generally happy with the system. And in time, by next year or a year after that, we shall have all our Police Divisions converted to the NPC system.

Let me now come to Mr Peh Chin Hua's question whether we are only catching the Tua Pek Kongs and not the masterminds. The Police must be also interested in syndicate leaders, not just only the runners of the syndicates. Wherever possible, they will go after them. The Police has indeed been successful in a number of such cases. One recent example was in December last year when the Police smashed a syndicate which supplied immigration offenders as labourers. The syndicate leader and his associates were all arrested. They were all responsible for managing the illegal workers. They were deploying them to the various companies and worksites and they were also collecting the payments. The syndicate leader has since been charged in court and the case will come up for trial.

[Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair]

5.15 pm

The Minister for Home Affairs (Mr Wong Kan Seng): Last year, the Police also busted two illegal moneylending syndicates that were active in Circuit Road, Geylang and Changi areas. The two masterminds of the syndicates who are responsible for providing money to the runners to operate the illegal money-lending business were also arrested. Both masterminds have been brought to justice. But breaking up syndicate operations and arresting and prosecuting the leader of the masterminds is not a simple and straightforward issue because it will take time. It involves careful planning, careful intelligence collection and elaborate investigations. You do not just rush in there and catch somebody and say he is the mastermind, otherwise you might catch the wrong guy and the real fellow may run away.

So let me assure Mr Peh that police does pay a great deal of attention on the mastermind, just as we also do on those who traffic illegal immigrants or who traffic in drugs. I think the most important thing, of course, is to go after the mastermind. As far as possible that will be done. But let me also say that it is more than one person who will be involved and if we chop one head, new heads will pop up. Some of them may not even be here to be found. I will tell you that in many instances the masterminds of the illegal immigrants are actually not in Singapore. They are not based in Singapore. They might be Singaporeans but they are not based in Singapore. So it is not that easy to catch them.

The Minister of State for Home Affairs (Assoc. Prof. Ho Peng Kee): Sir, I will now take the three cuts of Mr Kenneth Chen, Prof. Chin Tet Yung and Mr Goh Choon Kang.

Mr Kenneth Chen said that the Government has made it difficult for Singapore citizen mothers, including single mothers, who have lived abroad and divorced their foreign spouses, to get Singapore Permanent Residence (PR) status for their children when they return.

Sir, let me first say that it is not true that the Government has made it difficult for Singapore citizen mothers who have lived abroad to get PR status for their children when they return. These Singapore citizen mothers would be assessed no differently than if they had resided in Singapore all the time, in other words, they are not penalised for having lived or worked overseas.

Let me assure Mr Chen that the Government adopts a compassionate approach towards female Singapore citizens who sponsor their children for PR. Generally, as long as the female Singapore citizen is able to provide evidence to show that she is able to support the family financially, we would grant PR to her children. This is a justifiable requirement. In some cases, it might take some time for her to establish her income. So if the Singapore citizen mother continues working, it should be a matter of time before her child gets PR. In the event that the child cannot be granted PR immediately, the child is normally issued a long-term Social Visit Pass or Student's Pass so that he or she can remain in Singapore with the mother. In any case, where a case is marginal, we are prepared to exercise flexibility in granting PR to the child.

Sir, Prof. Chin Tet Yung has asked whether Singapore Immigration and Registration (SIR) can be more transparent in its replies to unsuccessful appellants. Prof. Chin would be pleased to know that this is indeed what SIR aims to do. SIR regularly reviews the way it replies to appellants. Over the years, the department has in fact become more forthcoming in providing the reasons for rejection. More efforts would be made in this direction in the future.

SIR would as far as possible disclose the reasons for rejection to the appellants. For example, in certain cases where the foreigner does not have a stable employment, SIR would inform the appellant that more time is needed to monitor his income and employment track record. There are also cases where SIR would advise the appellant to produce the necessary documentary evidence to substantiate the claims in the application, such as the relationship between the sponsor and the appellant.

However, the point to note is that in striving to be more transparent, SIR has also to be careful that the provision of reasons for rejection does not lead to abuse and circumvention of the evaluation criteria. SIR would continue to strike an appropriate balance between transparency and prevention of abuse, based on the merits of each case.

Now, I go to Mr Goh Choon Kang's cut. Mr Goh Choon Kang has expressed concern over cases involving maid abuse. He has asked for a response of the Ministry to a recent suggestion in the Lianhe Zaobao that a unit be set up to deal with allegations made by foreign domestic maids. Let me assure the House that the maid abuse situation is under control. The number of maid abuse cases is small relative to their population in Singapore. In 1999, there were 82 substantiated cases of maid abuse. This was slightly less than the 89 cases in 1998. However, the figures for 1999 and 1998 were significantly lower when compared to the 1997 figure of 157. This is due to the fact that in April 1998 we enhanced penalties against maid abusers in the Penal Code. So the situation has certainly improved.

To his question whether or not there is a need to set up a special unit to look after or investigate such cases, my Ministry has considered the suggestion but we feel that there is no such necessity. The reason is that these investigators are professionally trained and equipped to deal with the wide range of offences, including maid abuse and in some cases false allegation cases. All complaints and accusations by maids are treated seriously and thoroughly investigated, and where there is a need, interpreters are used. The current system is working well. There is no need to set up a separate unit.

Mr Kenneth Chen Koon Lap: Sir, last year, a few high profile drug busts were reported. Only yesterday it was reported that another drug ring has been crippled. This was indeed good news for Singaporeans. We should congratulate our drug enforcement officers' tremendous effort. However, we have not been informed of how this has affected the statistics of drug offenders. Can the Ministry release some figures of drug abuse in year 1999? Was there any improvement or did any such busts cause the drug abuser numbers to be decreased? I would also like to request for an update of the rehabilitation effort. What is the percentage of drug abusers who have been successfully converted? At the present moment, the law is harsh on drug consumers. It is rightly so because when one starts to consume drugs, it is likely that he would become a drug addict and we must spare no effort to ensure that this would not happen.

However, I would like the Ministry to consider, instead of harsh punishments such as jail or DRC detention for long periods of time, whether there are more effective ways to deal with first time offenders so that they would not be stigmatised and put themselves in a position where they will have no opportunity to go back to normal life because of a moment of weakness. I think it is important to try our best to help them to get away from this vicious cycle of drug abuse as the more they are isolated and outcast the more difficult it is to rehabilitate them.

Assoc. Prof. Chin Tet Yung: Sir, I echo Mr Kenneth Chen's request for more details on the drug situation and also join with him in congratulating our CNB for the successes in fighting the drug problem. In 1998, we were informed of the improving drug situation. They both had dropped in the number of arrested and improvement in the relapse rate of drug addicts over the corresponding figure in 1994. It has been two years since, and besides abuses involving traditional drugs such as heroin and cannabis, we also learn with concern from the media that abuses of new forms of drugs such as Ice and Ecstasy have been on the rise in the region. It has also been reported that these new drugs no longer have to be supplied from traditional sources like the Golden Triangle but can be manufactured in laboratories here.

Sir, we must ensure that we continue to maintain our tough stance against drug and drug traffickers and to ensure that our young people are adequately informed of the danger of drugs and not experiment with them. I would therefore like to ask the Minister to provide the House with an update on the local drug situation since 1998 and to let us know what his Ministry has done or will do to ensure that the drug menace remains under control, particularly in relation to the newer drugs that have come on to the market.

Mr Peh Chin Hua: (In Mandarin): Sir, the strict enforcement of law in Singapore is well-known throughout the world. That is why our public law and order, as well as drug control, is much stronger than in many other countries. This is something that we are very proud of.

I fully admire the police force and the various law enforcement agencies for their spirit of professionalism. However, recently, I discovered that some law enforcement agencies have been too rigid enforcing certain types of offences and they have forgotten that sometimes within the law we should also exercise some mercy and compassion.

Recently, in my meet-the-people session, I came across two cases. In the first case, a resident in my GRC was retrenched during the financial crisis. For quite some time, he was unable to find a job to support his family. In order to make ends meet, he was stupid enough to succumb to circumstances and resorted to sell uncensored VCDs. Although the VCDs he sold were neither pornographic nor religiously-sensitive, they were nevertheless illegal. During a raid by the police, he was arrested. He pleaded guilty in court and was sentenced to two years' imprisonment, even though he was a first offender with no previous conviction.

A second case involved a female resident in my GRC. Because of family and some financial problems, she was induced by somebody to take drugs and the very first time when she was taking drugs, she was arrested by Central Narcotics Bureau (CNB) officers, and charged in court. Upon conviction, she was sentenced to one year's imprisonment, albeit a first offender.

No doubt, selling uncensored VCD is an offence. But for a first offender, the sentence of two years in prison is too heavy. In order to earn a living, he did not resort to robbery or secret society activities, but was merely selling some uncensored VCDs. As a first offender, a sentence of a few months' imprisonment would have been adequate to serve as a deterrence to him. To me, a two-year jail term is manifestly excessive. He had given an assurance not to repeat the offence. After interviewing him, I was convinced that he was truly repentant. I made representation on his behalf to the relevant authority, but it was rejected by the prosecution and the judge. I wonder if we could sometimes temper justice with mercy, and give these first time offenders with good mitigating circumstances a chance to turn over a new leaf. Likewise, this female resident who was arrested for consumption of drugs was fully remorseful and promised not to consume drugs again. I have written four or five letters to the various departments and even with all the counselling that she had undertaken, her mitigation plea was not accepted by the authorities. She was sentenced to one year's imprisonment.

Sir, no doubt, they were guilty of the offences that they had been charged with. They were sentenced to imprisonment. There is nothing we can say about it. But for first offenders, can we not be slightly lenient and be more compassionate to them?

Mr Chng Hee Kok: Sir, with the rapid advances in technology and DNA testing and accuracy of the results, I think it is timely for us to develop a DNA database for convicted criminals. Presently, this is done in several developed countries and the results have been positive in solving crimes committed by known criminals. I do not intend to go into the technical merits of DNA testing and the results and so on, but I am confident that building up a database will help in the long term in solving crimes and of course in improving our crime fighting abilities.

I want the Minister to update the House on what are some of the concrete plans that we are doing in this direction.

Dr Teo Ho Pin: Sir, since the introduction of the Neighbourhood Police Centres last year, a number of temporary NPCs were built to serve residents in various constituencies. As the NPC is a new concept, there is not much provision to integrate the siting of NPCs in both new and existing towns. Thus, not much priority is given to NPCs when they are selecting suitable sites for development. In many cases, NPCs were simply asked to co-locate with many other organisations.

In view of the above, I would like to make the following clarifications:

(1) Can the Ministry incorporate the planning of NPCs in the

Development Guide Plan so that NPCs can be suitably located to better serve our residents?

(2) What are the selection criteria when selecting a site for NPC? 5.30 pm

Mr Chiam See Tong: Sir, a Singapore citizen complained in the Straits Times of 14th October last year that his identity card was stolen and he had conclusive evidence of the theft; yet he was made to pay $100 for the replacement of his IC. That incident brings up the following issues.

Firstly, it shows that the Government bureaucracy is totally inflexible. In that case, the Police had caught the thief and the thief had admitted that he had disposed of the complainant's IC. There was indisputable evidence that the complainant's IC was stolen and not negligently lost. Yet, he was made to pay $100 for the replacement of his IC.

Secondly, the money collected is excessive. If it is a genuine case of having one's identity card stolen, at most the Government should only charge an administrative fee of, say, $5. The local banks only charge that amount for the replacement of lost ATM cards. The amount of $100 for replacement of an IC is definitely not, I believe, to cover for the administrative cost, but as a punishment or a penalty. The end result, of course, is that the Government's coffers will become even more with money. The Government should not ingrain in its civil servants to be so inflexible when it comes to imposing penalties. They should be compassionate. If there is a good explanation or good reason why the IC was lost, they should not blindly just force the complainant to pay $100 but look into his case compassionately.

Thirdly, this case shows that if there is no check on the Government's bureaucracy, it can abuse its powers. Not only the bureaucrats in that instance took $100 from the complainant but threatened to charge a further $300 if the next time he lost his IC, although, in the first instance, that person had indisputable proof that his IC was stolen. Contrasted with the civil servants, the people in the private sector must be given top marks. Happily for the complainant, the POSBank and DBS did not charge him the $5 replacement for the reported loss of his ATM card. In fact, the officers of those banks waived the $5 replacement fee when he showed them the police report.

Sir, I hope that this matter will be looked into by the Minister.

Mr Wong Kan Seng: Sir, Mr Kenneth Chen and Prof. Chin asked about the drug situation in Singapore. Since the peak of the drug problem in 1994, MHA has taken a multi-pronged approach in dealing with this problem. This was done through preventive drug education, very rigorous enforcement, rehabilitation and aftercare of those abusers arrested or detained in the DRCs. This strategy has worked well and I am pleased to report to the House that the drug problem continues to be well under control.

The number of drug abusers arrested fell by a marked 15% from 4,500 in 1998 to about 3,800 in 1999. The continued high price and the low purity level of heroin in the local market also confirm that the drug situation here has improved. The purity level of the heroin, the main drug of abuse, has fallen to an all time low of less than 3% compared to 7% in 1996. Over the same period, the price of heroin has actually increased from $10 a straw to $20 a straw. For the second consecutive year since 1998, the number of new drug addicts arrested has also remained below 800. The last time it fell below 800 was in 1986. CNB's enforcement, as you read from time to time in newspapers, continued to remain rigorous. It conducted 48 major operations last year, crippling 30 drug trafficking syndicates in the process. Approximately 50 kg of heroin and about 7 kg of cannabis were seized last year. About 100 kg of opium and over 17,000 Ecstasy tablets were also seized.

The National Council Against Drug Abuse has continued to play a crucial role in preventive drug education. The Council works very closely with the CNB, with the schools, voluntary welfare organisations as well as the private sector corporations to run programmes to specifically target at-risk youths and there was a mass awareness programme highlighting the dangers of drug abuse. For example, the Council works closely with SANA (Singapore Anti-Narcotics Association) to put together an outreach programme targeting out-of-school youth called the Peer Alliance Liaison or PAL programme. Many voluntary welfare organisations have since joined this programme to turn at-risk youths away from abusing drugs.

The Council also works very closely with advertising agencies under the banner of Partnership for a Drug-free Singapore. This Partnership devised innovative ways to spread the anti-drug message. Last year, the Partnership organised an anti-drug song writing contest, published a parents' guide to drug prevention and developed innovative advertisements showing the dangers of heroin, Ecstasy and Ice abuse, and these agencies actually put in a lot of their own time and resources and expertise in helping in this effort.

In 1998, I briefed Members on the rehabilitation and aftercare measures undertaken by my Ministry. And I highlighted the community-based programme which releases addicts into the community to continue their rehabilitation in supportive environment, such as half-way houses and the offer of employment opportunities for addicts through the SCORE's job placement service.

Besides continuing with these measures, we also offer more educational and vocational training for drug addicts in the past years. The commencement of the Prisons school this year also gives better facilities and more opportunities for drug addicts to study. Information technology classes have also been introduced to the drug inmates last year. And these measures have contributed in some way to the reintegration of the addicts into our society. As a result, we saw a decline of the relapse rate from 81% in 1994 to about 52% last year.

For first-time abusers, Mr Chen has asked whether there are better or more effective ways of dealing with them. Let me assure Mr Chen that we do try to help the first-time abusers who are earnest in wanting to kick their drug habit. The Prisons Department actually runs a treatment programme called the Voluntary Treatment Programme which is basically intended for first-time abusers. Under this programme, first-time abusers who confess and volunteer to go for treatment in Changi Hospital will be given the opportunity to undergo detoxification and follow-up counselling sessions, without being committed to the DRC and therefore have no record, so to speak.

But the number of first-time abusers who actually successfully complete this programme is dismally low. Many of them just do not have the stamina, determination and discipline to go through with it. Out of the 137 abusers who signed up for this programme since 1996, only 44 of them eventually completed the programme.

We are prepared to help the first-time abusers to help themselves. But, ultimately, they must help themselves. Because if they do not, nobody can help them. If Mr Chen or anybody else can think of better ways of rehabilitating them, I would be very happy to look into them. But let me tell him and everybody here, that nobody enjoys sending a drug abuser to a court or to the DRC, because ultimately we would like to have our society rid of this problem. But if he does not heed the law, then, of course, the law has to take its course.

As regards Mr Chng's question about the DNA technology, let me say that my Minister of State has already mentioned something like that the last time he spoke on this. The Police is already beginning to study this to find out how it can make better use of DNA technology for its investigations. And it is looking at the practices in other countries, such as UK and US which have successfully set up such databases. The setting up of the database for DNA is indeed a strategic thrust of the Police. For forensic and intelligence-led investigations, DNA should become an important tool for criminal investigation as the criminals are now becoming more sophisticated, and conventional investigation methods will become inadequate. But the setting up of a DNA database is not a straightforward task because it will take time, as operational, technical and legal issues need to be looked at. We are now working with the Health Ministry and AG's Chambers on this.

Dr Teo Ho Pin asked about the NPCs and the criteria we use for selecting the sites for the NPCs. We want to site the NPC where the community is. Where else can it be? It cannot be tucked in a corner somewhere in Singapore. It ought to be convenient, central and easily accessible. As far as possible, we will also try to site the NPC together with the community clubs, community centres. We already have done so in a couple of the community clubs and centres where the NPCs are co-located. Over the years, we are going to have another 10 or 12 more such NPCs co-located with the community clubs.

It is a policy of the Government, and here I am wearing my two hats as People Association's Deputy Chairman as well as the Minister in charge of Police, that we would have the NPC co-located with the community club as far as possible. We have to maximise the land use. It is a luxury to have a stand-alone community club occupying 0.4 or 0.5 hectares of space. I think in land scarce Singapore, we should maximise the land use, put as much of our communal facilities together as possible, so that they can share in the use of land as well as become convenient points of contact for Singaporeans. Quite a number of other organisations are co-located with the community clubs, such as the library, NTUC child care, Council of Social Services and some corporate members of the People's Association.

Assoc. Prof. Ho Peng Kee: Sir, first, let me take Mr Peh Chin Hua's cut. I would now respond to his concern that there should be greater compassion when the Police and law enforcement departments enforce our laws, particularly against first-time offenders.

Sir, both the Police and the Attorney-General's Chambers already exercise compassion whenever appropriate, before a decision is made to prosecute offenders. If the offence is a minor one and the offender has a good record, indeed he may be let off with a warning, instead of being charged in court. For example, in 1998, over 1,800, constituting about 40% of shoplifters, were let off with a warning. However, being forced by circumstances as an excuse is not acceptable and is not a justification for committing an offence. Sir, neither should a person be exonerated nor spared punishment merely because he is a first-time offender.

Sir, cases of the sort that Mr Peh mentioned must have been serious enough for the offenders to be charged in court in the first place. The court then takes into account all the relevant facts and mitigating circumstances before deciding on the appropriate punishment in accordance with the law.

Sir, our laws and enforcement approach are tough but fair. Our enforcement agencies will continue to exercise compassion where justified. In line with this approach, as Mr Peh would know, my Ministry is working with the relevant Government agencies to put in place a range of new sentencing options such as community service orders, front-end home detention, boot camps, and probation for adult offenders. These sentencing options carry a greater rehabilitative element and would be suitable for persons who have committed relatively minor offences and first time offenders. They will complement existing forms of punishment and broaden the court's sentencing options. 5.45 pm

Let me now take Mr Chiam's cut. Mr Chiam has commented that persons who are victims of crime are also penalised by the deterrent replacement fee through no fault of theirs. He feels that our civil servants are bureaucratic and Government is unfair in levying the replacement fee of $100. First, let me say that the deterrent replacement fee complements Singapore Immigration and Registration's (SIR) public education effort to get Singaporeans to take good care of their ICs. So it is not a blunderbuss approach. Indeed, before its implementation in July 1998, there was a public campaign advising Singaporeans of the situation which was bad at that time and in fact giving prior warning to Singaporeans that if the situation did not improve, tougher penalties would be imposed. Before the fees were implemented in July 1998, the number of lost ICs was not only high, but was on an uptrend. The monthly average of about 3,300 cards lost in 1997 rose to about 4,000 in the first half of 1998. The number has since dropped to 2,600 monthly for the whole of 1999, which means that with the deterrent regime people have been reminded that it is important to take good care of their ICs. This figure, although lower, is still a serious problem.

Sir, let me assure Mr Chiam that SIR, like I have said just now, does not take a blunderbuss approach because it does exercise discretion in waiving the deterrent component of the replacement fee carefully on the merits of each case. For example, SIR waives the penalty where the IC holder is not at fault, such as in the case of break-ins, robberies, or losses due to fire. Indeed, between July 1998 and February 2000, SIR waived the penalty for about 7,000 cases. Hence, these IC holders only have to pay the recurrent replacement fee of $60 which incidentally is just above the cost of a new IC which is about $50. So the Government is not levying the fee to make money.

The onus is on the IC holders to explain the circumstances in which the loss occurred. In cases where the circumstances of the loss were dubious, for example, persons are unable to recollect how the IC was lost, the request for waiver of the penalty fees will not be acceded to. Mr Chiam referred to a writer in the Straits Times' Forum last year and I believe there were also one or two other writers. Let me tell him that, following further interviews and clarifications given by the IC holders in those cases, SIR gave them the benefit of the doubt and waived the penalty fees for them.

Sir, the other point is that Mr Chiam compares the approach taken by banks to SIR. Banks do not charge very high administration fee for an ATM card. Is he serious in comparing an ATM card with an IC? If one loses an ATM card, perhaps at most, he loses his money in the bank. If one loses an IC and if enough Singaporeans lose their ICs, it will impact on Singaporean's sense of safety and security because you may have people who get hold of these ICs and, in fact, there are syndicates who do that, and they will fall into wrong hands. That is why I think we must be very careful with them.

The Chairman: Order. It is "guillotine" time. Mr Chng.

Mr Chng Hee Kok: I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The sum of $1,245,016,660 for Head Q ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $912,051,300 for Head Q ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.

Head W -

The Chairman: Head W - Ministry of Trade and Industry. Mr Leong Horn Kee.

Mr Leong Horn Kee: Sir, I beg to move,

That the total sum to be allocated for Head W of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100.

Sir, actually there are two key imperatives in the economic development of modern day Singapore. One is to ensure that we devote sufficient resources and effort to build Singapore into an advanced knowledge-based economy that can compete with the rest of the world. The second imperative is to mould and build our local people and local capabilities that could measure up against the best in the world.

Unfortunately, within the framework of Singapore, we are actually faced with many constraints. First, we are small. Second, we have no resources and, third, we have limited manpower. But remarkably, despite these handicaps, we have managed to work together as a nation that has achieved phenomenal stability and growth in the last 30 years, and ranked as one of the most competitive countries in the world. No mean achievement for Singapore.

Sir, allow me to discuss in big broad strokes some of the major issues and actions that the Ministry of Trade and Industry has to address as the key national agency that oversees economic development of Singapore. Given our well known constraint, this is not an enviable task.

Sir, on cost competitiveness, because of our shortage of land and manpower, our cost of doing business continues to be high and not competitive versus the neighbouring countries. The Government has been vigilant over business costs. We cannot artificially suppress business costs, but we should at least ensure that such costs do not escalate, or unnecessary costs or time be wasted due to bureaucratic rules and regulations. Many of my fellow GPC colleagues have touched on this point. Some, such as Inderjit Singh and Mrs Lim Hwee Hua, have conjured the vision of an entrepreneurial civil service. I support their vision, but I despair that this vision will only remain as a hope unless there is more urgency in the declared plan on infusion of entrepreneurial blood in the top ranks of the civil service and the leadership, and a major paradigm shift in the mindset of our civil servants.

Second, maximising the use of our resources. We have to maximise the use of our limited resources. The land use in Singapore can be intensified by allowing higher plot ratios for land development and more flexibility in the change of use and the type of use of our land. For example, Sentosa Island is one of our main tourist attractions, and the playground of the residents living in the main city. Hence, I feel that Sentosa Island should have been more intensively developed, and the infrastructure should be improved. More attractions can be added.

We should also do a review of our electricity, gas and water supply and the usage policy so as to ensure that these precious resources are efficiently produced and used in Singapore.

Third, maximising the use of our limited manpower. As it is now, we have to bring in large numbers of foreign professionals and workers to supplement our local pool. Hence, we have to create an environment where both local and foreign manpower can give their best. By this, I mean we have to actively promote technopreneurship.

Arising from my professional occupation as a director of a local firm that is interested in e-commerce investments, I have recently met with and come across many local firms and young persons who want to start up new businesses. Sir, I can feel in them a strong sense of purpose and urgency in them wanting to venture out and start up companies based on their ideas and dreams. The Government has started the Technopreneurship 21 programme. I fully support this programme. In fact, I would like to urge the Government to do more, such as providing more funds, support facilities and create a conducive environment for enterprise, and for those daring to dream and daring to venture.

Sir, I shall elaborate on each of the above ideas in more detail as I speak on each of the subjects later.

Mr Thomas Thomas (Nominated Member): Sir, I support efforts to promote our external economic wing by encouraging companies and Singaporeans to invest overseas. All Singaporeans are representatives of our country when we are abroad. We are all ambassadors of Singapore. Therefore, how Singapore companies manage and how Singapore managers and workers conduct themselves will affect the impression ordinary people of the host country will have of Singapore. It is therefore in our national interest for people in countries receiving our investments to have a positive impression of Singapore. To cultivate this positive impression, we need to look beyond sheer profits for our companies. Local people who work in Singapore companies and with Singapore managers are in the best position to act as a conduit for us.

There are many examples of countries with poor record. The United States has a terrible record of human rights in Latin America which is still being repaired. There are also records of some East Asian countries with poor record of human and labour relations in some of the South East Asian countries. Therefore, Singapore companies and Singapore managers will have to realise that it is not just profits that make for successful business. Beyond maximising shareholder value and pursuing economic efficiency, companies will need the human face and human values, ie, the need to sustain families, treat men and women equally, look after the environment, to respect natural justice, to give workers dignity at the workplace, respect the rights of workers to form trade unions and to conduct collective bargaining and to comply with the laws of the land of the host country, and the list can go on.

Therefore, in this context, Sir, I like to ask the Minister that while encouraging investments overseas, his Ministry should also advise Singapore companies and Singaporeans to be aware of social issues and sensitivities like labour rights, human rights and environmental issues. This is especially needed when operating in countries with repressive regimes in power. It is better that we be proactive in this area before someone does something that damages Singapore's good name.

Mrs Lim Hwee Hua: Sir, allow me to begin my cut with an illustration. There was once a contract manufacturer which began a very successful operation in Singapore. It was able to meet the needs of a huge multinational electronics corporation that had decided to outsource some of its manufacturing activities. As time grew, more MNCs became its customers and in Singapore, capacity was gradually added. Every employee, including the non-production worker, could see and feel the pace of growth. Because the company's track record was so good, when its biggest client decided to produce in China, it was invited to set up supporting manufacturing facilities there. Growth there was soon exponential, well in excess of that in Singapore.

Now, if the Singaporean employees were focusing only on the hive of activity at their own plant, they would not have shared the excitement of growth in China. Likewise, if there was a structural change which led to the MNCs ceasing production in China, they also would be none the wiser. However, if they had had a total picture of the entire network of operations, they would be better informed of their company's plight through thick or thin. Sir, I hope this illustration will convey the need to plug the following information gaps in the measurement and assessment of economic activity for Singapore.

Firstly, to enable Singaporeans to embrace the global nature of our economic being, we should also highlight Gross National Product (GNP), or its equivalent, instead of stopping at Gross Domestic Product (GDP). This gives a broader reflection of our reach outside of Singapore. A quick look at the 1999 Economic Survey shows some differing trends, granted that comparison only in current price terms is available.

Secondly, even though services, including financial services, constitute a substantial pillar of our economy, measures are few, perhaps inherently so. Nonetheless, as services are crucial to us, I would like to urge the Minister to continue seeking out appropriate measures and indicators. Trade statistics abound and are available on a monthly basis, but they do not form a complete picture. Hence, they may overstate the deterioration in the economy, as was the case for some months in 1998. 6.00 pm

Thirdly, business cycles have shortened through the judicious application of technology. Therefore, frequency and timeliness of economic statistics are key to helping companies and individuals project ahead. Can the Minister explore how far this can be done?

Mr Leong Horn Kee: Sir, first I would like to declare that I am a Director of a company involved in property development. We have to maximise the use of our limited land. I like to propose the following suggestions on how land can be used more intensively.

Firstly, to allow the use of higher plot ratios for land development. Compared to the major cities around the world like Tokyo, Hong Kong and New York, Singapore is less developed in terms of land use. In these cities, their buildings are definitely higher and land development is being used more intensively.

Secondly, to allow more flexibility in the usage and change of use of existing buildings and built-up areas. Some buildings or areas were constructed for an original approved usage. However, over time, the demand or the nature of the location changes. Hence, there may well be a need to change the usage to another type so as to match the surrounding developments. For example, a building may originally be built as an industrial building. But as it turns out, there is more demand in the locality for use of the premises as showrooms, offices or even as residences. The owners should therefore be allowed more flexibility in the usage and conversion. Otherwise, the building will remain vacant and unused.

Thirdly, the possibility of co-location and mixed use of different types of premises will enable more intensive use of a building. Subletting and renewal of leases will enable the existing premises to be better used, or re-developed for other purposes.

Sir, in land scarce Singapore, I feel that within certain broad rules and guidelines, it is very critical that land use be more flexible and intensified.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, we are familiar about the current interest and the type of industries we want for our economy to grow and we have focused a lot on the info-communications area, electronics, semi-conductor, pharmaceutical and chemical industries and I believe that some of us will start planning about the type of industries we want 20 to 30 years from now.

I would like to ask the Minister as to what, in his opinion, we should be focusing on in the longer term. Are we doing enough in promoting life sciences, bio-technology and genetic engineering in Singapore?

Sir, may I move on to my next cut?

The Chairman: Carry on.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Many Members have expressed their concern that by rolling back some of the cost containment measures, it may affect the cost competitiveness of our manufacturing sector and businesses in general.

I would like to touch on a few of these issues. First of all, I am concerned that the JTC rentals of factories will go up as a result of the property tax rebate reduction from 55% to 25%. Similarly, the rental rebates implemented in 1998 will eventually be removed, bringing land cost back to pre-crisis levels. If this happens, we will once again become uncompetitive as compared to our neighbouring countries where permanent reductions in prices have occurred. I therefore feel that through land intensification measures, we can keep our future land and rental costs low and any future increases will continue to be benchmarked against world prices so that we remain relevant in these industries. Mr Leong has given some excellent examples of how we can keep land cost low in the future.

Similarly, we should watch out against any drastic increases in Government fees and charges in the next few years. These too should be benchmarked against global prices before increasing any of these in the future.

Thirdly, we have been pre-occupied by cost issues in most of the measures that we have implemented in the past couple of years and I think we should now go beyond cost and focus on value-added activities as the focus on how we can become competitive in the future. One possible concept is to encourage more assetless companies who can outsource their make functions to any part of the world, while focusing on the value creation activities with the limited resources we have here in Singapore. This will require a different set of incentive schemes and I suggest the Ministry study possible options to encourage the growth of such companies in Singapore.

Fourthly, I have a concern that there will be increases of utility charges as we go on. In fact, electricity charges have already gone up by almost 20% recently while prices of water will be going up later this year as was announced by the Minister for Finance. While I understand that we need to price water realistically, I believe that the Government could have held back any increases by another year to minimise any increases during this transition year and which we can continue increasing as we go along in the future. On the issue of the cost of electricity, I feel that the power generation and distribution infrastructures in Singapore are not operating efficiently enough. In fact, I believe that the cost is about two to three times more expensive in Singapore as compared to the United States of America. I strongly feel that we need to completely privatise the current power generation and distribution services and to open up these to true foreign competition.

Fifthly, still on the issue of power, there have been too many instances of power dips, causing serious disruptions to our high-tech industries like wafer fabs and also some semi-conductor manufacturing facilities. These dips and disruptions cause money and I feel that the company should not bear the full burden of this cost and that the power distribution company should also be liable for part of the cost incurred by the affected companies.

Mr Heng Chiang Meng (Cheng San): Sir, the projection of the World Bank and the Asian Development Bank made in 1997 for environmental infrastructural projects such as water, sewerage, power and waste management in South East Asia alone was about US$20-US$30 billion annually.

As the countries in this part of the world become more affluent, demand for such environmental related businesses, together with non-infrastructural products and processes, will, in fact, be much larger. And if we consider the countries of China and India and South Korea, if these countries are included, the size of the potential market in such businesses in this region could be as high as about US$50-US$60 billion annually.

Sir, Singapore is a small country and we are constantly on the lookout for suitable business and industrial niches and, therefore, I think Singapore, being right in the middle of Asia, cannot ignore this potential niche. We have been successful in niches such as finance, electronics and specialty chemicals. We are now promoting IT, telecommunications and the life sciences. Surely, given the potential of the environment-related industry, we should also promote this particular sector to be located in Singapore. I hope that the Ministry sees such a potential and gets EDB to have a serious look at these businesses. I also hope that the Minister, when he asks EDB, will also consider the following initiatives to help Singapore develop into an environment industrial park.

Firstly, there should be schemes to support and encourage environmental technopreneurs to start up new companies similar to those given to IT entrepreneurs.

Secondly, an Exim-type of financing facilities to be made available to support projects in emerging economies in the region. In this particular business, such financial assistance is quite common. In fact, one of the reasons why the South Korean companies and the Japanese companies, amongst the Asian countries, are very successful in this business is because of the Exim-type of loans provided by their respective countries or by institutions supported by the Government. This will certainly help Singapore companies to compete with companies like the Japanese and Korean companies. And, more importantly, it will put us on the same footing as a lot of other western companies too and, in fact, some form of equal partnership can be formed between the Singapore companies and the foreign companies.

Thirdly, financial incentives for Singaporeans and companies in Singapore should be given for them to use environment positive products and processes. This type of financing incentive will certainly encourage the greater usage of environment positive products and processes in Singapore leading, I believe, to a very much better environment here.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, I would like to share my thoughts on how we can participate in the Internet economy and what all of us, both the public and private sectors, can do in order to compete successfully in this economy, especially in the area of e-commerce.

First of all, the barriers to entry in the e-commerce arena are typically very low and we will see many almost similar businesses sprouting all around the world as compared to those that we start here in Singapore. One important lesson to learn is that while we may have thought of a seemingly unique idea and business model, there are many more smart people around the world who have probably also thought of it at about the same time. Therefore, the first mover advantage is going to be the key and the first mover is the one who introduces the idea first to the marketplace. Having become the first mover, speed and constant innovation and improvement will help us keep the lead and I will not belabour on the Internet speed again. It is crucial in this area if you want to be successful.

In order for our companies to be successful, they will need very good and cheap infrastructure which, in my opinion, is still an issue in Singapore. Some Members, in their earlier speeches during the MCIT debate, have compared the cost of using broadband network here with those around the world. We are still not competitive and while for big businesses, the cost may not be a major issue, for many of our start-up companies, the cost is still very painful.

Thirdly, my concern is that in our eagerness to promote the information communications industry, many investors, including the National Science and Technology Board, may be disbursing funds a bit too liberally. In fact, we have already used about half a billion dollars of the $1 billion fund in these last six months. While I am not advocating that we should slow things down, I do, however, feel that we need to inject some realism as to what the Internet economy is all about. At the end of the day, a business is still a business, and a sound model and strategy are still needed in order to compete effectively globally. So I hope that our young and aspiring technopreneurs will look beyond the initial hype and the short-term possibilities and focus on building sustainable businesses for the long term. The typical terms used in the Internet economy are:

a) The "burn rate" which refers to the rate at which you spend the money in sustaining the business.

b) The "last man spending" which refers to when the money eventually runs out at the rate at which it is being burnt. The last company that remains in business is the one that is going to be the winner.

These are very interesting terms but every entrepreneur should treat his every cent as his or her own and he should not develop the attitude that someone else's money is being burnt, and this is the danger of liberal availability of funds in trying to promote such an Internet economy.

Fourthly, to be successful, we need to focus on building businesses that have good or unique technology content or unique technology applications or those who make our traditional brick and mortar businesses more efficient with the use of information technology. I therefore urge both the private and public sectors to focus in these areas if they really want to be successful and, in the long term, when the bubble bursts and the hype goes away, only the fundamentally strong companies are the ones that will be left standing. So there are portals that we see developing which will be in danger if they do not build fundamentally strong ideas and strategies.

Fifthly, one useful role I believe that the National Science and Technology Board can play is to regularly organise lessons, sharing seminars or gatherings, where we can invite both the local and foreign technopreneurs to impart their experiences, both good and bad, so that we can avoid making the same mistakes others have made in the past. Up to now, we have been painting too rosy a picture and have highlighted mainly the successful companies and very few failures have been highlighted. We should, in fact, celebrate both failures and successful companies, especially those failures who eventually made it again after they have failed the first time.

Sir, we have no choice but to participate in this new economy and, in doing so, we should be well-prepared and play with the desire to win big. We therefore must ensure that we build a conducive environment for this to happen.

Mr Ahmad Mohd Magad (Pasir Ris): Sir, whether we like it or not, employment of e-commerce as a means of doing business in the Internet economy is increasing with each passing day.

To be a global player, Singapore has no choice but to embrace its widespread use. I am happy to note that the acceleration of the e-commerce usage has been identified as a key strategy under one of the three pronged approach to SME development in the recent SME 21 launch. While I am encouraged that the Minister for Communications and Information Technology has spoken in this House about swift liberalisation of the telecommunications industry and keener competition which will benefit consumers, I am concerned about the preparedness of businesses to face this dramatic change expected in the near future. 6.15 pm

Sir, several of my MP colleagues yesterday, and Mr Inderjit Singh a moment ago, also spoke at length about the rapidly increasing e-commerce trends and the urgent need to educate and reach out to various constituent groups of this impending change. My primary concern is the urgent need to get Singapore SMEs to exploit e-commerce to enable them to effectively compete in the global marketplace. We need to quickly plug them on to existing B-to-B and B-to-C portals and, wherever necessary, facilitate the development of more portals for various sectors.

First, I would like to propose that e-commerce development initiatives undertaken by SMEs are strongly supported by the Government, and that such support be incorporated in current Government assistance schemes such as VTAS and LEFS.

Second, to facilitate speedy development and implementation, several Government agencies such as the IDA, EDB, PSB, NSTB, etc, should be identified to play catalytic and lead roles in strategic e-commerce development projects, such as the grooming of selected promising SMEs and the promotion of adoption of locally available portals. Their roles and activities should be coordinated to ensure efficient deployment of resources and no duplication of efforts.

Third, recognising that only 4-5% of our local SMEs currently adopt e-commerce, we should get more SMEs to e-invent themselves, and also set a target for a reasonable number of SMEs to be using e-commerce in their business activities by a certain period, say, about five years from now. The goal should be not only for our business entities to use e-commerce as a tool, but also to get them to embrace e-commerce as an integral part of their business strategy.

Mr Leong Horn Kee: Sir, under the Technopreneurship 21 Plan, the Government has allocated US$1 billion to promote technopreneurship. Recently, Deputy Prime Minister Dr Tony Tan announced that over half of this sum has been committed for start-up companies and venture funds which promote such technopreneurship development in Singapore. Dr Tan announced that this investment fund will be fully invested by June, and the Government is considering launching a second fund.

The effects of the funding support from the Government and the drive towards technopreneurship is being felt in Singapore. As I have said earlier in my speech, in my recent meetings with young founders and managers of several local start-up companies, I can discern a strong sense of purpose, drive and direction amongst them. There is a strong emergence of heightened energy level amongst these young people who ventured to found new start-up companies. I strongly feel that we should continue to harness and propel this growing energy by providing more funds, more support facilities such as incubation centres and creating a conducive environment where our local technopreneurs can flourish.

To continue with this Technopreneurship 21 drive, I would like to suggest that the Government should allocate more money, say, another US$500 million or even a full US$1 billion towards the new Technopreneurship programme. In addition, instead of channelling the new funds to the existing two agencies, ie, the National Science and Technology Board (NSTB) and the GIC, to allocate out the funds, I would like to suggest that some part of the new funds be assigned to a third agency which has a large proportion of private-sector trained executives to be in charge. The two existing agencies, NSTB and GIC, have done an excellent job. The idea of a third body to have a new high number of private sector staff agency, maybe a new one, would serve as a third body to provide more avenues for start-up companies and technopreneurs to seek funding support.

Sir, during the Budget debate, I also proposed that pioneer status, ie, five years' tax free status, be accorded to start-up companies. These companies are pioneers in their own field such as info-com and biotechnology, and they should be encouraged. They will form a new wave of pioneering changes in upgrading the industrial development of Singapore. Sir, I am particularly keen on this idea of a pioneer status for high-tech start-up companies, not so much for the incentive as not many of them will make money in the first five years to enjoy this tax benefit, but for the recognition that we give to them, and in the process create an environment whereby more high-tech companies are encouraged to be formed, just like in the early days of Singapore's industrial development, pioneer companies were given this special status.

Sir, I feel that the proposed additional fund and a third agency to channel through the funds and awarding pioneer status to selective start-up companies will serve to give another boost to Singapore's technopreneurship plan.

Mrs Lim Hwee Hua: Sir, as part of giving the promotion of technopreneurship a shot in the arm, the Government is establishing a Science Hub. For the Science Hub to fully realise our objectives, the least of which is to provide a conducive and vibrant environment for the nurturing of knowledge-intensive capabilities, I would like to ask the Minister what economic model would be used.

I am especially interested in how the Government will drive this effort as there are multi-faceted needs to be met, such as nurturing, social and leisure requirements, if one were to use the Silicon Valley as a model.

In addition, I would like to ask the Minister to indicate what the concentrations are likely to be.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, the Technopreneurship 21 Committee launched by the Government is one excellent example of how the Government and the private sector can play their part in trying to promote entrepreneurship and technopreneurship in Singapore. Today, in the knowledge-based economy (KBE), Singapore, more than at any time before in its history, has a best chance to compete with the world's best countries on a level playing field. We have no lack of ideas and talent but we need a more conducive environment and motivation factors that can be created by both the public and the private sectors. While I am not advocating too much of Government interference, I do feel that in making the transition from a paternalistic approach of governance to one of an entrepreneurial governance, the Government can become a catalyst and a facilitator, and once we have taken off, they should take a few steps back.

The National Science and Technology Board's role needs to be one of a facilitator and incubator, and perhaps a funding agency to do well in promoting entrepreneurship, rather than being the main driving force. The NSTB, to do this role effectively, will need to hire as many industry experienced people as possible, so that it can be effective in executing its role.

Secondly, the governance with a lighter touch will help us create a more conducive environment. I have heard of many cases of restrictive Government practices like the sub-letting of JTC and HDB premises, the Building and Control Authority's and the Fire Safety Bureau's stringent requirements and restrictions make it very difficult for setting up such offices, especially for a small group of entrepreneurs who need to spend more time focusing on the real value added activities. But sometimes they get distracted in trying to fulfill the requirements of such agencies, and this is really a waste of time.

Thirdly, the proposed Science Hub at Buona Vista is an excellent start of how we can create this conducive environment. And I suggest that in this Hub, we should allow some amount of untidiness, some chaos and practise as much flexibility as possible, as compared to what we cannot practise out in Singapore, in general. We should try to, as much as possible, duplicate the Silicon Valley type of environment in this area. In fact, once we have learned from the Buona Vista Science Hub, I think we can afford to make the whole of Singapore a science hub where we can practise all of the things that we have learned from Buona Vista. This is one way that we can become the Silicon Valley of the East.

Fourthly, to support the Industry 21 programme which the Economic Development Board announced last year, I suggest that we set up permanent industry groupings. Instead of relying on ad hoc groups, I believe that if we have permanent industry groupings, this should allow us to focus a lot more on the various sectors that we want to promote. I suggest that these permanent groupings be funded jointly by the Government and the private sector, and through this, I believe a more focused approach will help us succeed in achieving the Industry 21 programme.

Fifthly, to promote more cottage industries, I suggest that we liberalise the use of HDB shophouses for info-communications type of companies. This can be an extension of the home-office scheme that we have implemented recently. In my opinion, this will make our housing estates more vibrant, allow entrepreneurs to have their offices near their homes, and also become an integral part of the community where they work. I believe this will also help alleviate the problem of excess retail space that we are facing in our housing estates today.

Sixthly, to bring in more talent has always been a big issue for Singapore. I would like to ask whether the Government is willing to consider setting up centres of excellence in a few countries, like in India, China, Philippines, Thailand, the USA and a few other countries around the world, where some of our activities, whether it is private sector or Government activities, can be outsourced to these areas. And these are the areas where we can groom and identify talent who could in turn flow back into Singapore. We will have a better chance of attracting the best talent this way and, at the same time, have access to as much and to a bigger pool of people as possible.

Seventhly, we need to strengthen the generation, maintenance and the use of intellectual property as a competitive tool in promoting our high-technology industries. Currently, I believe that we do not have enough intellectual property lawyers nor a strong infrastructure to support this important area. And I think we need to spend some time developing this if we are very serious about starting up many more technology companies in Singapore.

Assoc. Prof. Toh See Kiat: Sir, in recent years, big has become beautiful. The bigger, the better to participate in the global economy. Hence, there seems to be a race to make the next merger bigger than the last. Very quickly, the mega-merger of AOL and Time Warner was eclipsed by the Vodafone-Mannesman mega-merger.

In Singapore, the merger of the two banking giants of DBS and POSB became history with the merger of SIA and Virgin, a merger of sorts. And then there was the near merger of SingTel and C&W HKT. Even so, our mammoth SingTel is actually only 26th in size compared to the telco giants currently existing, and the merger would have them up only by a few notches if they had been successful.

Global monopolies and cartels wield much power. Witness the De Beers monopoly of diamonds and the OPEC oil cartel, which is still a force to reckon with. Local monopolies are treated differently in different countries, of course. In the OECD countries, monopolies are theoretically prohibited by anti-trust and anti-monopoly laws. The philosophy behind these laws date back to the 1930s, when big was regarded as bad.

Monopolies and cartels are bad for the consumer, because of their power to control prices and manipulate markets to the great inconvenience and disadvantage of the consumer and smaller businesses. This is particularly so in consumer products and services which for the most part function in imperfect and captive markets. Hence, the Internet and global competition will ensure that the power of localised monopolies is reduced or nullified. This is because the Internet allows the consumer to buy not just from MPH or Times Bookshop, but also from BarnesandNoble.com and Amazon.com. It allows the consumer to get information about prices, quality and availability of products and services more readily and thus makes for a more perfect market.

In this brave new world, it becomes increasingly difficult to enforce or to justify laws regulating monopolies and cartels. Even countries with supposedly strict competition laws close an eye to the realities which have resulted in the mega-mergers I have mentioned and to those like DaimlerChrysler, PriceWaterhouseCoopers and the Citi Group. In this light, it will be fundamentally anachronistic, it would seem, to ask for laws protecting consumers from monopolies and cartels. But I shall try.

I want to make a case, Sir, for limited regulation in situations where the market is effectively closed; the market for petrol in Singapore, for example, or the market for household goods and consumer equipment. Then there are the public transport and public utility sectors. In these situations, market dominance is still possible because the consumer has no real choice when it comes to alternatives. 6.30 pm

I am happy, of course, that in public transport and utilities, the monopolies, duopolies and cartels are closely monitored by the regulators - who indeed are also looking to create competition wherever they can. Witness the telecoms and the power supply industries, and the beginning of free competition in public transport.

Deregulating and liberalising previously closed sectors is not good enough, Sir. Closed markets cause our businesses to be complacent and cumbersomely inefficient, stifle their growth and hamper their ability to survive in the global economy. Look at our banking industry and legal profession, for example. Hence the beginnings of change there also.

I want to urge the Ministry to look into monopolistic conduct and business practices and make these illegal. We may not break up our relatively small companies in the name of competition but we certainly can discourage them from unconscionable conduct. Much of this market unfriendly conduct may even look innocuous. A market leader could resort to predatory pricing to kill off competitors, deny access to smaller competitor on the pretext of its inability to pay on time; collect deposits from customers on all sorts of pretexts and not return the money promptly or at all; clog up competitors' distribution channels with massive numbers of small purchases; set so-called recommended retail prices with severe contractual penalties for breach of that price; or quietly collude with other service or goods providers in an unwritten pact, therefore no evidence, which obliges them to maintain the same price levels whatever the true economic costs of doing business.

Sir, these are not hypothetical situations. They have actually all happened in recent months and even for years on end - in the telecoms industry, petrol stations, supermarkets, car dealers, the list goes on.

Sir, when are we going to stop closing an eye to such inequity? These situations can be nipped in the bud if we had a Fair Trading Act. CASE will be submitting a paper to the Ministry on such an Act after our visit to Australia and New Zealand in May. We will bring a team of consumers, businessmen and officials to observe the impact and effectiveness of such a law and make recommendations on our return.

I hope the Minister will give the paper careful consideration when it is submitted.

Mrs Lim Hwee Hua: Sir, much has been said already in this House about the role of Government-linked companies or GLCs in driving economic growth in Singapore. Also, many Members, including myself, have exhorted the Government to constantly review and identify candidates for privatisation where private sector pressures would make sense.

Whilst privatisation may provide the best models in many cases, GLCs who prove their worth can continue to justify their existence.

In fact, GLCs may well be a good intermediate step or model for certain Government-run operations. Specifically, the Government should review the extent to which sea port services should be deregulated and whether certain ports, such as Jurong Port which supports the Jurong industrial estate, should be corporatised or even privatised. I would like to ask the Minister to comment on the feasibility of such a transition.

Mr Sin Boon Ann: Sir, competition and the free market represent an important ideological underpinning of our society. It is a trite statement to say that competition allows for greater variety and therefore freedom of choice for the consumers in the market place. Without competition, a wide array of goods and services available to the consumer would not have been possible. Until recently, we are confronted with an alternative choice to the free market - the command economy. We have seen that command economies produce excesses that result in great inefficiencies in the market place. Someone once joked that the East Germans under the communist regime, could only choose between a red Trabant or a white Trabant, a three piston car with polluting exhausts. I will not be surprised if that were true.

Yet, Sir, free competition without regulation also produces excesses. Starting from the premise that not all firms are of equal ability, extreme competition would feed on the predatory instincts of businesses seeking to survive in the market place. Just as in the natural world, only the strongest will survive and the weaker ones will perish into oblivion. What happens is perhaps a growing dominance of the market place by a few major producers of goods and services. In the hands of these few major producers or even single producer of goods and services, the consumer is left very much at their mercy because of their extensive power over the price which they charge for their goods and services.

Sir, it is for this reason that many countries in the West have passed laws that regulate against the formation of monopolies or cartels and anti-competitive practices. Such entities are, by its tendency, an antithesis to this idea of freedom of choice for the consumer. The Americans understood the benefits of the market early and have since the 19th century enacted such legislation as the Sherman Act and the Clayton Act and other legislation. Many European countries, including Australia, have also adopted similar legislation.

As Singapore becomes a mature economy, it is perhaps timely that the Government should look to comprehensive anti-trust laws to check against the excesses of firms that dominate the market place. The advantage of these policies is obvious. Recently, we have seen that as a result of competition, overseas telephone charges began to fall dramatically. As another example, when StarHub introduced free Internet services in a bid to attract subscribers. Almost overnight, another rival Internet service provider responded by offering free services as well. The move by the ISP to save customer accounts is not surprising.

Sadly, it is not seen by many as a sincere move on its part to provide best service for its customers.

Sir, I understand that the IDA plays the role of regulator in checking, amongst other things, the competition among telecommunication companies. However, there is no watchdog body like IDA with respect to the other parts of the industry at the market place. One question that I would like to ask the Minister therefore is whether the Government would seriously consider introducing legislation like the anti-trust laws which are applicable in the United States and elsewhere.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, the support for small and medium enterprises (SMEs) has always been a topic discussed by many Members in this House. The real issue is that we have not been able to find the right formula to help our SMEs effectively. The many schemes available are not fully benefitting the smaller companies and we need to relook at how best to incentivise such companies. While the Productivity and Standards Board (PSB) is working hard at it, I believe there is a serious misalignment of the needs versus the help available for such SMEs.

The SME 21 is a good plan but, in my opinion, the implementation is not going to be easy and we may end up with just incremental changes but what we really need is some revolutionary changes if we are serious about creating many more world class companies out of these SMEs.

In my opinion, we need an EDB-style organisation which is able to grant incentives like pioneer status or other incentives that Mr Ong has talked about earlier on. This agency should, first of all, have a focused look at growing local world class companies while EBD should continue to focus on multi-national companies. In my opinion, with the current set up, the EDB cannot effectively focus on both sectors.

Such an organisation will also have the flexibility to select, groom and help grow companies from the start-up stage to the time they become world class companies or MNCs in their own right. Such an approach where some agencies follow the life cycles of a company will allow faster action and support to the specific needs of such companies. Because such agencies will know the needs of such company well having followed them throughout their life cycle.

Secondly, in my opinion, the selection criterion for promising local enterprises is outdated. The question I have for the Minister is, how many of these PLEs have, in the past, actually made it as world class companies and in return how many of the world class companies that come out of Singapore were identified as PLEs before. I suggest we induct the private sector to help determine and choose PLEs for these Government agencies. This is an example of the outsourcing of Government of Singapore to the private sector.

At this point of time, we need the focus agencies to nurture, groom, grow, guide and launch local companies into the global market place if we are serious about creating the 100 or so world-class companies that we talked about last year. So my previous suggestion of these independent organisations should be considered seriously.

I suggest we spin off the PSB or part of PSB into a jointly managed consortium managed by both the private and public sectors with complete independence of management but perhaps guided by a board consisting of people from both the public and private sectors to provide strategic direction. This can be jointly funded again by the public and private sectors and there is an organisation called the SEMATECH in the USA. With such an independent body, the SME 21 will have a much better chance of success because of the direct private sector involvement to allow faster decisions to be made.

I also suggest that we devise some incentives to encourage the merger and consolidation of our SMEs. Many of them may not be able to operate, given their small size and inefficiencies they may have. The feedback that I have is that current regulations in Singapore create too many obstacles for companies to merge.

Fourthly, while many things have been said about the practices of GLCs, I do however feel that the GLCs can play an important role if they are privatised and run independently. GLCs could also partner our local SMEs for global projects as is being done by a number of countries, for example, in the UK and Japan. GLCs should therefore be given appropriate incentives to help such SMEs to secure overseas business together with their projects.

Mr Zulkifli Bin Baharudin (Nominated Member): Sir, I share a lot of the views expressed by Mr Inderjit Singh earlier. I want to go into some practical points but, first, in my view, SMEs today face very exciting challenges but very frustrating problems also. Exciting challenges in the sense that never before have they been able to see lower barriers of entry. Technology and Internet allow them to open their market and allow them to make network and connections with many people in the world without even having to leave Singapore. But what is very frustrating to them is that there is a great demand for intellectual capacity for them to take advantage just presented before them. That is for many reasons. But one of the reasons is that in Singapore, when you start to compete with the best and the brightest in the world, you are faced with great odds. Because in Singapore the best and the brightest join the Government. Maybe the second-best join the MNCs and then you are left with a very deprived intellectual pool in the SMEs.

When you want to go into very high leading edge practices, sometimes it is very difficult. This is where I feel we can do a lot more to help them because while the workers can do many things, they can get new graduates from the universities and polytechnics, it is the leaders of the companies themselves that must keep up with the speed and changes in the economy. I see the case of Hewlett Packard in Singapore and they have spawned many public-listed companies like Omni Industries, Venture and NatSteel and so on, because when they start to outsource business to these people they do take a personal stake in these companies in the sense that they get their engineers and their planners to be involved in the entire outsourcing process. So they are not just some sub-contractors but they are themselves investors and personally involved in this. They have spawned world-class companies like Venture, NatSteel in the world. This is where a working model is available in Singapore. So they can have large GLCs. They get business and give it to sub-contractors and some MNCs complain, "I can do what the GLCs can do except that I do not have a name like GLC." To overcome this, what we could do is GLCs starting to take an interest and stake in small companies, take it through mergers and acquisition. In this way, you tap on the entrepreneurial skill but you can also help translate leading edge technologies and practices that are available to GLCs to these small companies.

The other thing that perhaps we can do is that at the centres where there is a lot of leading edge, like the universities and the polytechnics, we should encourage more of that to get out and work directly with some of these small companies. These small companies sometimes find it very hard to invest in training. They do not train as well as the MNCs. But if you can tap on to the R&D of universities and polytechnics and get these academics to work on areas other than business, in engineering or in other research work, we can avail these best practices to small and medium enterprises, otherwise they may not be able to afford this.

I think GLCs can also benefit because one of the things that may be problematic in the future is that as GLCs try and go into the region, how they are perceived by people in the region may be problematic because they do not just see their commercial presence but they see the Singapore entity behind it and people are very nationalistic. They may not welcome some GLCs. If you could collaborate, bring in more entrepreneurs to be involved in some of these projects, we can buffer some of the nationalistic sentiments that some of these countries may respond to when Singapore Incorporated tries to expand to the region. Certainly, I share with Mr Inderjit Singh the other incentives that we need to offer in terms of taxation and incentives to provide training to these companies. I say again that training is not just for those who are already at risk. New technologies are putting at risk a whole host of people who may not be aware that they are at risk today, but certainly it will be too late by the time companies start to move out. By the time companies start to move out, they find themselves completely out of sync with the needs of the economy and technology. 6.45 pm

So I think we need to really look far ahead and see who are the people - the receptionists, the tellers, the little managers - who will be made virtually extinct by new technologies. How do we help them before they really become virtually extinct or redundant? This is where I think further collaboration and specific attention given to SMEs, understanding their weaknesses, can help. GLCs can play a great part here to help SMEs.

I hope the Minister could give some attention and direct some resources to help these SMEs.

Mr Ahmad Mohd Magad: Sir, the recent launch of SME 21 and its broad range of strategies and programmes appear poised to well position our SMEs in the 21st century. In fact, the SME 21 document distributed during the launch is so well regarded that I understand it is officially requested by many countries worldwide.

However, Sir, I believe, while the ideas and strategies have been well conceived, there was no reference whosoever being made to benchmarking or learning from the experience of others. I am not suggesting that this is not already being done, but I am sure we are aware of the merits of benchmarking against others, in this case, against other countries which are more experienced and are ahead of us in promoting SMEs. In the United Kingdom, for example, where there are more than 3.7 million enterprises, of which only 7,000 are large establishments, the government acts as catalyst to encourage collaboration for corrective competitiveness. As a result, one in 10 SMEs is able to set aside 10% or more of their sales turnover on new products and process development. Australia is quite ahead in government-led strategies to tap the vast potential of e-commerce by creating a dynamic business environment, promoting transactions via the Internet, and also conducting regular dialogues with the business community to discuss on-line business issues. Taiwan and Korea, while having a more liberalised business environment, implement policies which are designed to strengthen the quality framework and technological competitiveness of their SMEs.

Sir, although some strategies adopted by these countries may be unique to their local and specific situations, I believe many are also generic and applicable as well to us. I would therefore like to urge the Minister for Trade and Industry to consider putting in place a barometer to benchmark ourselves against what some of the best in the world are doing to promote SMEs.

Mrs Lim Hwee Hua: Sir, the SME 21 is a comprehensive effort to develop the role and contribution of smaller companies to the growth of Singapore. At the same time, it also addresses the issues that vulnerable sectors, such as retail and construction, are facing and recommends some strategies for survival, for example, consolidation for small operators to achieve economies of scale.

But, Sir, as my colleagues Mr Singh and Mr Magad have observed, we know that whilst a lot of effort has gone into formulating the blueprint, it is the follow-up, in terms of rendering actual assistance to target SMEs, that will make the difference.

I would like to ask the Minister how the relevant agencies can proactively help such vulnerable businesses. In particular, will their efforts extend to the neighbourhood shop operators, especially those who are non-English speaking, or who may be unaware of the existence of the SME 21 altogether? Sir, many neighbourhood operators may have been running chronic losses but still feel they have no alternatives. For such operators, where cessation of business could well be the only solution, can placement and retraining assistance be extended as well?

Mr Tay Beng Chuan (Nominated Member): Sir, based on its Desired Outcomes, the Ministry of Trade and Industry appears to be only interested in nurturing only the more successful local enterprises and forging a strong partnership with the MNCs. If this is its main direction, how could we expect MTI to channel adequate resources to give priority attention to achieving the aim of the SME 21, which is to build up the capability of the SMEs?

SMEs are indigenous to Singapore and are important constituents of the Singapore economy. The SME 21 plan launched in January has given due recognition to this and wants to make a concerted effort to assist SMEs keep pace with the rest of the economy as a critical part of the national plan to sustain Singapore's economic growth.

Given its importance, I feel that this should have been given and reflected in the Budget Statement or budget provision for MTI. In fact, there is not a single provision for the promotion of the implementation of SME 21 in the Budget. How could the local business community react positively to the objectives of the SME 21 without a very clear and strong commitment on the part of MTI?

Like the lower-income group among the heartlanders in HDB estates, who have been assisted to move on to the mainstream of life through substantial help and support by both the Government and the community, the SMEs who can be classified as the lower-income group in the competitive business world, would also require greater care and help before they can be singled out as successful enterprises in their own right, and thereon to be nurtured as world-class companies.

In forging a strong partnership with MNCs, the Government ought to guard against creating a misconception of favouring the MNCs at the expense of our indigenous SMEs. The Government must find ways and means to encourage or get our MNCs, as well as GLCs, to contribute their part to the general well-being of the local business community, with the principal objective of creating a pro-business environment for all enterprises in Singapore, both big and small.

The MNCs and GLCs have ample resources with the facilities, direct access to information or even relevant authorities for their business operation and expansion. As such, they do not feel the compelling need to join or contribute to the local trade and industry associations. On the other hand, many of our trade and industry associations exist to serve the needs of SMEs. And with the limited membership dues collected, they find it extremely difficult to make a strong commitment of their limited resources to the implementation of any national economic plans such as the SME 21, or even to promote IT applications among the SMEs in support of Singapore's IT plan.

The situation calls for Government funding as well as more voluntary or even mandatory contribution of resources from the MNCs and GLCs, and even our very successful local enterprises, to enable our local trade and industry associations to draw up various schemes and programmes to effectively service the business community. I therefore urge the Ministry to take the initiative, together with the major trade and industry associations, to draw up some concrete measures, including certain financial and technical assistance schemes for the SMEs and their trade associations as a big step towards building a vibrant, resilient and cohesive business community where all enterprises, big and small, can contribute to the growth of the economy.

The Chairman: Mr Ong Kian Min is not here. Mr Ahmad Magad.

Mr Ahmad Mohd Magad: Sir, much has been spoken in the last several days and today about the importance of promoting entrepreneurship and technopreneurship as one of the key activities for Singapore to focus on. We need a new generation of home-bred wealth and value creators who could play a meaningful role in continually improving the standard of living of Singaporeans as we hop on the global stage.

The awareness created and the many schemes we have put in place have encouraged many younger Singaporeans to want to jump on the bandwagon. However, as adrenalin begins to flow and ideas begin to sparkle, many are discovering to their dismay that funds availability represents a major stumbling block to execute and market their ideas.

I would like to suggest that we consider setting up an agency where technopreneurs and high-tech aspirants could readily come to and meet with venture capitalists and interested angel investors who, at the same time, are also looking for investment opportunities. The agency's primary activity is to marry ideas which could potentially strike big, with funds to bring the ideas into reality. I envision an agency, Sir, where the technopreneur aspirants present their ideas and business plans to interested investors where technopreneur marriages are solemnised and hopefully live happily ever after.

Seriously, Sir, I believe the availability of such an agency would help to increase the momentum of entrepreneurial activities. To widen its scope, such an agency could simultaneously act as a one-stop agency for SMEs to obtain information on the multitude of Government's assistance schemes and other forms of help available for both new start-ups and existing entrepreneurs to grow their business.

Mr Inderjit Singh: Sir, there is a perception that the Government and the Economic Development Board are no longer considering trading as an important economic activity in Singapore. In fact, I have heard a number of good traders who actually have left Singapore for trading cities like Hong Kong and Dubai, citing cost, support and also financing ability as reasons.

In my opinion, for us to promote the e-commerce industry in the future, the trading community actually can play a very important role to promote this concept of a click and mortar concept where the traditional businesses are made efficient by the use of information technology to compete effectively in the world arena. The traders probably, having traded around the world, are the best people to promote this portion of the growth that we want in the Internet economy.

Sir, last year, I also spoke about possibilities of implementing trade financing schemes, similar to the LEFS scheme for the manufacturing sector. After speaking in Parliament last year, I discussed some potential approaches with the Trade Development Board officers. I think they have come up with some possible plans. And I would like to ask the Minister whether he will consider implementing them because these plans will not incur too much of Government funds. But what we need is for someone to get it started and, I think, if it has started, the Government can take a step back because the scheme will run by itself - run by the private sector, the banks and the insurance agencies.

The other thing I would like to talk about is trade exhibitions and shows. I believe since 1994, the subsidy given to our companies in attending shows and exhibitions overseas has been reduced drastically from about 70% down to about 35%. I would like to ask the Minister to consider increasing this back again to around 55% and to fund some of the industry organisations, like the Chambers of Commerce, to actually help such companies attend such trade shows.

Finally, I believe the infrastructure costs in Singapore still need to be addressed. PSA charges are still not competitive compared to the best ports around the world, like in Rotterdam. Telecommunication charges are still an issue. If they are serious about promoting this industry, we should look at all these things.

The Chairman: It is 7.00 pm now.

Thereupon, Mr Deputy Speaker left the Chair of the Committee and took the Chair of the House.

The Minister for Trade and Industry (BG George Yong-Boon Yeo): Mr Deputy Speaker, I beg to report that the Committee of Supply has made further progress on the Estimates of Expenditure for the financial year 2000/2001, and ask leave to sit again tomorrow.

Mr Deputy Speaker: So be it.