EXEMPTED BUSINESS

EXEMPTED BUSINESS:

(Motion): With the consent of Mdm Deputy Speaker and the general assent of Members present,

Question put, and agreed to.

Resolved,

That the proceedings on the item of business under discussion be exempted at this day's sitting from the provisions of Standing Order No. 2. – [Mr Mah Bow Tan].

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COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY: Head I (cont.) –

The Minister for the Environment and Water Resources and Minister-in-charge of: Column: 2239

Muslim Affairs (Assoc. Prof. Dr Yaacob Ibrahim): Madam, the Malay/Muslim community continues to progress. Primary 1 school enrolment is almost 100%. At least one out of every three students from a P1 cohort enters local tertiary institutions.

The Malay workforce is better educated. At least 20% of Malays are in professional and higher skilled jobs, three times the proportion in 1980. The median monthly income for Malays has also more than tripled over the same period. More than nine in 10 Malays, or about 93% in 2005, own their own homes.

Madam, we are also beginning to see the results of our efforts to address the social challenges faced by the community. First, the number of divorces among Muslims dropped by 11% – from 1,944 cases in 2006 to 1,747 cases last year. The number of minor marriages – where either the bride or groom, or both, are below the age of 21 – also dropped by 7% from 440 in 2006 to 410 in 2007. And I hope this trend will continue.

We have also not shied away from tackling difficult issues. In fact, the community has come together, in the spirit of consultation or musyawarah. We have openly discussed issues such as dysfunctional families, the inclusion of Muslims in the Human Organ Transplant Act or HOTA, and the changes to the full-time madrasah education system. It is through this spirit of musyawarah we have been able to address key issues affecting our community and our nation. Let me take this opportunity, Madam, to thank everyone in our community – community and religious leaders, our parents, asatizah , our workers and students – for our unity and joint efforts to help our community move forward.

Mr Hawazi Daipi and Mdm Halimah Yacob have raised concerns about the low

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income group and about the effects of rising cost of living on all Singaporeans, especially the economically vulnerable in our community and low-skilled and low-wage workers. Both Members have also asked what the community and the Government will be doing to help the low-income families.

From the recent data that we gathered from the Department of Statistics, it shows that among employed households, all income groups, including the bottom 20% of households, experienced increases in household income from work per household member in real terms for 2007. Nevertheless, we are aware that many low-income families still need help to meet rising costs. So we have adopted a two pronged approach. First, we leverage on Government's initiatives and, second, we develop programmes for specific vulnerable groups within the community.

The recently announced Growth Dividends and last year's GST offset package, which are weighted in favour of low-income families, provide relief to needy and disadvantaged families. Assistance schemes, such as the Kindergarten Financial Assistance Scheme (KiFAS) and the Centre-Based Financial Assistance Scheme for Childcare (CFAC), help their young children attend pre-school, while programmes like the Home Ownership Plus Education (HOPE) scheme provides incentives for them to improve their lives and their financial situation. The Healthy Start Programme also provides a holistic intervention for at- risk families. Other ComCare and Workfare Income Schemes provide financial assistance while developing self-reliance.

Last year, MUIS disbursed $4.2 million of zakat funds to help the poor and needy Muslim families. Of this, $3.5 million was disbursed as direct monthly assistance and $700,000 on empowerment and capacity building programmes.

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So to answer the question by Mdm Halimah, what is being done, let me give a summary. Between 2004 and 2007, 400 families with young children participated in the Empowerment Partnership Scheme (EPS) to help needy families become self-reliant. 209 families have successfully graduated from the EPS and are no longer reliant on MUIS financial aid. Mr Imran Tukijoe's family is a good example. Mr Imran, who has four school-going children, approached MUIS in 2004 for financial assistance as both he and his wife are unable to find work. Under EPS, Mr Imran took various courses to enhance his job prospects while his wife completed a professional beautician course. Both of them are now gainfully employed and have a combined household income of more than $3,000 per month. 200 new families joined the EPS last December, giving us a total of 600 families that have either benefited or benefiting from the scheme.

Sir I am happy to announce that for 2008, MUIS has set aside a sum of $6.5 million for low-income families and empowerment programmes. This is a 55% increase over last year's budget. So we will do more to help low-income families. This increased budget will allow us to better help the needy and disadvantaged Malay/Muslim families in Singapore.

To address the needs of specific vulnerable groups, Mendaki started its Dedicated Programme for Single-Mother Families (or DPSM) in February 2007. Under this scheme, single mothers and youths from single-parent families will be referred to social service agencies based on their needs to improve their employability. Response to the programme, Madam, has been very encouraging. A total of 438 single mothers and their older children joined this programme between February last year and December 2007. Of the 438 participants, 217 or close to half were placed

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in jobs, and one in three participants stayed on in their jobs for more than three months. One of the success stories involved Mdm Mislinah Bte Bakar.

Mdm Mislinah wanted to return to work after leaving the workforce for more than 10 years. She had lost her breadwinner husband to lung cancer. Taking into account her need to care for her four school-going children and her health, DPSM helped Mdm Mislinah upgrade her skills and find a job with a research company, earning $600 a month.

6.30 pm

Sir, let me know turn to the issue of minor marriages raised by several Members.

We have intensified efforts to help minor couples as well as their parents make informed decisions about marrying young. Last year, two centres dedicated to this effort were established. Known as INSPIRASI Hubs, the centres are run by the Association of Muslim Professionals (AMP) and the PPIS-Jurong Family Service Centre. Their efforts are also beginning to show results. Last year, among the 443 couples who attended pre-marital counselling, 141 couples, or one in three, dropped their plans to get married early.

For young couples who decided to proceed with the marriage, the INSPIRASI Hubs had formed Club INSPIRASI in December last year to equip married minor couples with skills and knowledge to deal with marital challenges and to strengthen their families. Since its launch in December last year, 83 couples have joined the Club.

We have not spared efforts to educate the community on strong family values and the need to keep marriages intact. An eight-episode TV programme, entitled Kpak Bing Bing which is the sound of the kompang was launched early this year. Its key message was "a happy marriage

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requires effort, and sometimes assistance". Such programmes have proved to be very useful in reaching out to the public. According to Suria, Kpak Bing Bing has been the channel's top weekly programme since its first telecast.

Several Members, including Dr Fatimah Lateef, commented that despite our efforts, the number of Malay-Muslim teenage divorces remains significant. Minor divorces – be it either husband or wife, or both were minors at the point of marriage – make up 30% of total Muslim divorces each year. Marriages involving minors are twice as likely to result in divorce during the first 10 years of marriage compared to marriages involving adult persons, probably because their young age and lower educational levels do not give them a stable start to married life.

The Government has studied this issue and I have quietly consulted many community leaders, including the Malay MPs. One upstream measure that we are planning to introduce is to raise the minimum age of marriage for Muslims from 16 to 18, in line with the Women's Charter. This will signal the Muslim community's resolve to tackle the divorce rates by curbing minor marriages. We are targeting to raise the minimum age later this year, when the Administration of Muslim Law Act (AMLA) is amended.

Dr Maliki and Mdm Halimah also suggested that efforts and initiatives to help low income and disadvantaged families should be better coordinated, so as to maximise our resources, reduce duplication, enhance outreach and ensure holistic intervention. I agree with both Members. Let me highlight two coordinating platforms which have been set up by MUIS and Mendaki.

The first coordinating platform is the Enhanced Mosque Cluster, or EMC, under

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MUIS. Under the EMC, mosques will take over the social assistance function previously centred at MUIS headquarters. Mosques will directly disburse financial aid from zakat funds to the needy within their respective communities. This is similar to the CDCs when they took over the financial assistance schemes from the then MCDS. With this scheme, mosques should also collaborate with other agencies to come up with specific programmes and customise services according to local needs. Being closer to the ground, they can address the needs a lot quicker and customise programmes to help the low income and disadvantaged families.

MUIS piloted the EMC in the Southeast Cluster in December last year. This pilot involved 13 mosques, with the Al-Ansar Mosque in Chai Chee as the operations centre. We will review this programme in June this year, before extending it step-by-step to the other clusters.

The second coordinating platform is spearheaded by Mendaki under the Community Leaders Forum (CLF). The Action Plan for Strengthening Malay/Muslim families is a wrap-around approach to help families facing multiple problems. This platform will improve the coordination of intervention efforts across national and community agencies. This is the point that was raised by Dr Maliki on how we should coordinate among the various players within the Malay/Muslim voluntary sector to ensure that there is greater impact. With this platform, we should be able to achieve that.

To date, five project managers for five zones island-wide have been appointed to build up partnerships with the agencies, the Malay/Muslim organisations within the districts, coordinate case conferences, advocate for families through the agencies as well as consolidate and analyse data on the community. Both the Enhanced

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Mosque Cluster and the Action Plan for Strengthening Malay/Muslim families will augment the national efforts to support and strengthen low-income and disadvantaged families. Dr Maliki also touched on the complexity of the problems of dysfunctional families. I would like to inform him that Mendaki is conducting a research to understand further what are the challenges faced by these families. And I agree with him that finances may not be the real problem and that the roots of the problems are a lot more deeper. We hope to tap on the expertise of the social workers to gain a better understanding.

Madam, let me move on to the question raised by Mr Zaqy Mohamad. He has asked for an update on the progress to help the madrasahs prepare for the PSLE this year. There are three key initiatives – Training for Madrasah Administrators, Enrichment Programmes for Students and the PSLE-ready package:

(i) For the training of madrasah staff, MUIS has invested $2.27 million since 2003 to sponsor the training of key madrasah staff such as Heads of Department and Principals;

(ii) On Enrichment Programmes for Students, MUIS spent $120,000 in 2007 to develop and implement enrichment programmes to help Primary 5 and Primary 6 madrasah students prepare for PSLE; in fact, some of the students are also enrolled in the Mendaki Tuition Programme; and

(iii) MUIS will provide a further $700,000 from 2008 to help the madrasahs meet the PSLE requirements under the PSLE Ready Package. The money will be used to provide training for academic subject teachers and will fund a teacher mentor scheme, where qualified teachers with experience teaching in national schools will provide guidance to

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our madrasah teachers. MUIS will review this package annually.

Mr Zaqy had also asked how we will ensure that the madrasahs maximise the financial grants given to them. For one, MUIS will be tracking the madrasahs' performances in two areas: the participation rate and performance of teachers who have undergone such programmes; and, finally, of course, the students' performance in subjects like English, Mathematics and Science.

Last October, I announced that three of the six full-time madrasahs will link up for the Joint Madrasah System, or JMS, to be implemented in 2009.

The three madrasahs – Irsyad, Aljunied and Arabiah – together with MUIS are developing a blueprint for the JMS – covering the philosophy, educational policies, desired outcomes, approaches and broad curriculum guidelines. A sum of $2 million has been allocated to start up the JMS. This will be used mainly for recruiting key personnel for the madrasahs . They need new teachers and new staff to implement some of these programmes. As the success of the JMS is critical, MUIS, with the agreement of the three JMS madrasahs , has decided to second several senior MUIS officers to the madrasahs to assist in the set-up of JMS during the transition phase. So we will lose some good officers. But we think this is important because we want to make sure that the JMS succeeds. The two-year secondment will help the three madrasahs build up their management capacity. Our long-term goal is for the three madrasahs within the JMS to be managed independently, albeit with MUIS assistance.

The remaining three madrasahs are welcome to be part of the JMS at any time, and any time they join they can benefit from all the additional programmes and initiatives lined up for JMS. So if

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they join early, they can get a lot of resources.

Madam, let me now move on to the issues raised by Mr Masagos and Dr Faishal. The recent detention of two 26-year olds who became radicalised after being exposed to radical teachings over the Internet again highlights the importance of proper religious guidance. Even though we cannot be 100% sure that we can keep out external radical influences, MUIS will endeavour through various measures to ensure that Singaporean Muslims have the knowledge and resources to understand and appreciate Islam, so that they are able to identify and keep away from what is not right. Mr Masagos Zulkifli had asked about the profile of the people who had been detained for radical activities. The detainees, according to our security agencies, do not have a specific profile. However, there are warning signs that friends or relatives could watch out for, which could include an increased interest in extremist or radical literature and websites, or expressing support for violence and confrontation in areas of conflict.

Both Mr Masagos and Dr Faishal asked what measures we have taken to counter self-radicalisation. In September last year, MUIS launched the INvoKE.SG website targeted at youths and working adults between the age of 15 and 35. INvoKE.SG provides information and runs discussions on issues of interest to our young. The website also helps the young to have a better understanding of the Singaporean Muslim identity that we have built up over more than 40 years. In addition to this, MUIS also launched a website, www.radical.mosque.sg , that provides a useful guide to help Internet users tell radical ideology websites from the legitimate ones.

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While all these efforts will empower Internet users with the skills to sieve out inaccurate teachings or misinterpretations of Islam, I think we all agree it is always better to get religious guidance from qualified religious teachers. Hence, I would urge parents and community leaders to continue to emphasise the need for our young to gain and deepen their knowledge through the guidance of our accredited asatizah and to contact MUIS for assistance whenever necessary.

Dr Fatimah Lateef had asked for an update on the Asatizah Development Programme. Asatizah can opt to participate in different programmes. We have, first, the Executive Development Programme which is intended for all asatizah and it develops participants' understanding of the different religions, as well as national issues. Of the 950 asatizah , more than 120 have completed this programme. Dr Fatimah asked me to publish their names. I am not sure whether it is necessary. More importantly, we want them to continue to participate in this programme. MUIS targets to train a total of 420 asatizah by end 2009. There are now the Professional Development courses which will equip our asatizah for additional roles, such as marriage counsellors, and for interfaith work. Some 70 asatizah completed the course in 2007 and by 2009, 170 asatizah will be exposed to this programme.

Finally, the Leadership Development Programme, which is modelled after the leadership programme for senior civil servants, will be offered to 30 senior asatizah . It will provide participants with a holistic perspective of public sector governance, and help develop strategic thinking and leadership. Sixty asatizah will be trained under this programme by 2009. The Asatizah Development Programme is progressing well, and I urge the asatizah to participate actively in all of these programmes.

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Dr Muhammad Faishal asked for an update on our community engagement programmes. Madam, over the last year, MUIS invited eminent speakers such as the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams and, the eminent historian, Ms Karen Armstrong, for MUIS's lecture series. Both lectures – just like the earlier lecture by the Sheikh Tantawi of Al-Azhar – attracted Singaporeans of all faiths who were keen to find out more about topics such as the role of religion in the modern world and inter-religious dialogue. The lecture by the Archbishop of Canterbury was the first collaboration between MUIS and the Anglican Diocese of Singapore. We hope to do more with other religious bodies in Singapore.

At the community level, our mosques are active in reaching out as important nodes in the neighbourhoods, leading and involving themselves in activities and projects with like-minded community and grassroots organisations. You may have read that I was at Al-Khair Mosque last weekend with hon. Members Mr Zaqy and Minister of State Gan Kim Yong to celebrate a Care and Share carnival conducted by one of our local mosques which has been actively involved with students and the community within the constituency of Hong Kah GRC. They have reached out and helped all students, irrespective of backgrounds, who are in need of financial assistance. So, we should encourage more of our institutions to do likewise. At the same time, our Harmony Centre at An-Nahdhah Mosque in Bishan continues to serve visitors of all faiths and nationalities.

This year, going forward, our mosques will also get together to organise a signature event in July, which is called a 'Rahmatan Lil Alamin' or 'Blessings To All' Day. This event will include a mass blood donation exercise and a reception for 1,000 needy families and elderly of all races.

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Madam, before I end, allow me now to summarise my speech in Malay.

( In Malay) : [For vernacular speech, please refer to Appendix A.] Madam, the Malay/Muslim local community continues to move forward to climb the ladder of progress and reach the vision of a Community of Excellence. In education, our students’ achievements are getting more visible. Unlike before, we now often hear news of our students’ excellent achievements in national examinations, such as the PSLE, GCE 'O' level, 'A' level and also examinations in the institutions of higher learning.

A number of Members, such as Dr Mohd Maliki, Mr Zainudin and Mdm Halimah, have expressed their concern about social issues that are impeding our community. I agree that we must continue to enhance our efforts to assist and guide the dysfunctional families, single mothers and the low-income families.

Madam, I am also heartened by the willingness and cooperation that was offered by all levels of the community in overcoming a number of difficult issues in the past year. For example, the whole community worked together to ensure that we are able to take care of and resolve the issue of organ transplant and the full-time madrasah education system. We are also willing to openly discuss the issue of dysfunctional families. The spirit of musyawarah (consultation) displayed by the community, ensures that we can continue to progress in line with the passage of time and current demands.

I would like to take this opportunity to express my deepest appreciation to all sectors of our community – students, parents, workers, community leaders and also the Malay Members of Parliament for rolling up their sleeves for the benefit of the whole community.

I acknowledge that more efforts must be made to further improve the com

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munity’s level of achievement. We should be grateful for our progress so far which we have gained through hard work, determination and commitment. I am sure we will be further encouraged to improve our achievements so that we can stand tall together with our fellow countrymen.

We hope our noble efforts will create a brighter future, not just for ourselves but also, more importantly, for our dear children.

*Cols. 2317-2318.

The Chairman: Clarifications. Any Member wishes to clarify? Dr Lam.

Dr Lam Pin Min: I would like to thank Minister Lim for his response to our call for a caregiver's allowance. In fact, I was quite heartened by his response when he said that the Government is not ready to provide the allowance yet, compared to what the response was last year when I brought this up. It was a flat no. I agree with the Minister that we must not monetise the duty and responsibility of providing care for our loved ones. In fact, we should not place a price tag to filial piety because it is priceless. However, for the low income family, this additional financial assistance goes a long way in alleviating the financial burden faced by them and many of these families are actually living from hand to mouth. Therefore, I would like to urge the Ministry to study this closely and hopefully, next year, we will have a positive reply.

Mr Lim Boon Heng: We will study the matter.

Ms Sylvia Lim: Clarifications for the Minister on the topic of juvenile homes. Earlier on the recidivism rate, the Minister mentioned the rate of about one-third recidivism within two years. But according to the estimates given to us, in page 63 of the Budget book, the latest

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recidivism rate for FY06 (actual) was put at 48%. Is it not closer to one is to two relapsing into crime within two years?

Second clarification is that the Minister did not address my query on the additional expenditure which is spending on security services to reinforce supervision and security in the MCYS homes. My question was: is this recognition that the homes have indeed been too lax and that there is a need to increase security provision? And last of all, has the Ministry actually done anything so far to try to arrest the increasing recidivism rate in juvenile homes?

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: I will double check the recidivism rate for her. Whatever it is, as far as I am concerned, it is too high. Yes, we are spending more money on security services, and I think this is money well worth investing in. Because, as I said earlier in my speech, we need to provide discipline and we need to provide security. Without that sense of discipline and security, rehabilitation will not work. So, yes, we are spending more money, and we will do so.

Having said all that, I also want to caution us against over reacting in a knee-jerk fashion to this rate. Let me give the Member an example. The easiest way for my staff in the Boys' Home and Girls' Home to lower their rate is to be more picky as to who gets admitted to the Home. If we work with more hardcore and more challenging cases, which I believe we need to, it will also mean our recidivism rate may go up. I think there is a balance.

I am not obsessively focused on just that rate, although I have said that the current rate, as far as I am concerned, is too high and I want it to come down. But I am not going to lower it simply by placing more barriers and saying, "Why not you go to Prison instead of the Boys'

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Home so that you don't affect my statistics?" I think she has raised a valid concern. It is a figure we should watch. I am giving her the commitment that we will continue to invest in whatever it takes to bring that rate down. And we need to do so because these are young boys and young girls. If we cannot get them back on the straight and narrow at this early age, they are condemned to a life of misery for themselves, their families and the community, and ultimately, it means a higher cost to us as a society. So we will work on this problem.

Dr Mohamad Maliki Bin Osman: Madam, two clarifications. In relation to juvenile delinquency and recidivism, I also raised the issue of the juvenile homes run by VWOs. I seek the Minister's response to the extent to which MCYS monitors these homes because I think there are a lot of homes that exist out there, and we do not know the extent to which the effectiveness of those programmes and homes. I wonder if the Minister can comment on MCYS' role in ensuring the effective running as well as the effectiveness of these programmes. The second point is in relation to community involvement in working with multi-pronged families. I applaud MCYS' position on involving the community, neighbours and friends to have a many-helping-hands approach. So I would like to ask if the Ministry has any plans to facilitate this process of greater community involvement in working with families.

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: I announced just now that we are going to amend the Children and Young Persons Act (CYPA), basically to allow us to regulate and to get more involved in working with the VWOs running all juvenile homes, or all homes with children and young persons in order to improve standards, maintain quality assurance and to achieve better outcomes. Yes, we are working on this. This is work in progress.

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The role for the community in dysfunctional families is something which we all instinctively know is the right answer. But it is very easy to say, yes, it is very easy to describe it in this Chamber, but it is very difficult. The Inter-Ministerial Committee is still at work on this and we have no illusions that this is not something which Government can do alone. We need the voluntary welfare organisations. We need the grassroots. We need everyone who is engaged in the community to play a part.

Dr Lily Neo has previously raised in her intervention earlier that we need an integrated system, and she is absolutely right. Because if we think what we have now, we have all the different pieces of the jigsaw there. Let me give Members an example. We have learning support programmes in schools for kids who may not be academically inclined. We know who are the kids who have dropped out or are at the verge of dropping out. We know who are the kids who have got disciplinary problems. That is one slice of it. On the other hand, from the Ministry of Home Affairs, we know who are the kids who have been caught shoplifting or the delinquents. By the time they end up in our Boys' Home and Girls' Home, they have actually crossed many rivers of crimes to have reached our shores. So the point is that MCYS also is involved.

When a child is dysfunctional, it is almost always, not just that child who is at risk, but there is another child, another sibling or family at risk. And this family would, in all likelihood, if they are in financial need, have approached the CDC or one of our grassroots organisations or even see us at the MPS. So the different pieces of the jigsaw are there in the sense that we all know different elements of this elephant. What we are trying to do now is to put these pieces together so that we achieve, what Dr Neo said, an integrated platform, information gets shared when we start thinking about

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solutions, we start thinking about the family, rather than just fixing an individual delinquent, a dropout or a drug addict, or fixing a financial problem on the part of the father or mother. I am putting all these knowing full well that there is a lot more work to be done. And that is why we form this Inter-Ministerial Committee because we realise that we need a common platform. In fact, this Committee will have to go on to engage the community organisations on the ground because, in the end, the hands and feet and the hearts and mind that will be brought to bear will be the people on the ground. They will not be policy makers or even MPs sitting in the Chamber, but they will be MPs on the ground at the meet-the-people sessions. So there is a lot of work to be done. Again, all I can do is to give her that assurance that we recognise, I agree with what she is saying, and we have to work on implementing it.

Assoc. Prof. Kalyani K Mehta: Madam, I would heartily thank the Minister for his announcement of the establishment of the accreditation framework for social workers in mid-2008. This has been a long awaited change for the social work procession. Thank you. One point of clarification. When will the benchmarking of social workers' salaries and VWOs with the medical social workers be implemented? Can I have a rough gauge?

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: My staff have already started work getting the data. So we should have some comparative scales out soon, meaning within the next few months. But I also want to caution that these social workers are not employees of the MCYS. They are employees of voluntary welfare organisations who have their own challenges, including funding challenges. They also have to manage their expenses. So I think it will take time. Even though we benchmark, even

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though we put in more funds, do not forget that on the ground, the VWOs are also raising 50% of their operational expenditure based on their own funding sources. I know it will take some time. But, nevertheless, I believe by a combination of factors, accreditation and licensing, benchmarking of salaries, MCYS putting more funds in, the public recognises that social workers and counsellors are professions and deserve respect and additional support. I am hoping that we will arrive at a situation where these professions get the recognition and remuneration that they so richly deserve.

Mr Seah Kian Peng: Madam, I want to ask the Parliamentary Secretary one question. He mentioned earlier that the Sports Council will be setting up an NSA Advisory Committee. I hope that, amongst other things, this Advisory Committee will look into my earlier point about the experiences of NSAs who adopt different approaches towards talent development and to make the recommendations accordingly. In the area of track and field, specifically the Singapore Athletic Association (SAA), I know many schools are very active on this front. But somehow, once they finish school, all these talents just seem to drop off from the scene. I want to ask the Parliamentary Secretary if there are some gaps in the development and nurturing of these young local talents by SAA.

Mr Teo Ser Luck: I thank Mr Seah Kian Peng for the question. The NSA's governance and management is always a challenge because we are dealing with more than 50 NSAs in Singapore. So everyone has different standards of management and different qualities of volunteers as well. This is a constant challenge. So we are going to attempt to set up a NSA Advisory Committee. Why? Because we want to share the best practices. A good example is sailing. Sailing has a very good youth

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development programme over eight or nine years. The programme has been successful in producing champions. We hope that they can share

these best practices with the other NSAs. Of course, there will always be NSAs that have spent a fair amount of investments, and yet the results do not equate to the investments that they have actually put in. So this is something that we have to work very hard on.

7.00 pm

I hope, through the Youth Olympic Games, that we can put in more resources and focus on youth development and build up a pipeline of young athletes and champions so that, in future, even after 2010, we will have a stream of successful athletes that are able to represent Singapore in international games.

Mr Zainudin Nordin: Madam, two points of clarification.

(1) Can the Minister consider relooking at the funding model for the VWOs with respect to the social workers' profession since the professionalisation of these workers was mentioned? We need to also moderate their expectations and understand the difficulties faced on the ground by VWOs. Can the Minister comment on this?

(2) How many social workers are we expecting to produce within the next five to 10 years to meet these challenges which we are going to face more and more in the coming years? Are we considering to produce also the para-social workers at the diploma level, not necessarily the degree-level type?

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: I said just now that we will have to increase the funding for VWOs. But having said that, the principles on which we fund VWOs, ie,

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we fund 90% of development costs and 50% of operational expenditures for approved programmes, those are long-established principles which I am reluctant to abandon at this point. So I am prepared to pump in more money, but I still want to work within those principles. At this point in time, it is worth reminding this House that, if you look at funding at the national level, we are actually not short of funds. I cannot remember if I said it just now, but Singaporeans donate more than $1.2 billion a year. This includes what they give to IPCs and charities. Frankly, for a lot of charities, including churches, mosques and temples, it is a bit hard for us to really keep track of every single cent that is placed on the altar. But I think that there is probably even more than $1.2 billion available. So when we talk about difficulty in fund-raising, I think we also need to be more innovative. The VWOs also need to show results and to convince donors that their programmes are worth supporting.

There is also another bit of public education that we need. People say, "I want to donate but I want to make sure every single cent goes to the beneficiary." Unfortunately, a lot of people still think that the social workers are volunteers, that they are working for free or expect them to be working practically for free. We need to educate Singaporeans that, yes, we know there is a voluntary welfare organisation at the top, and the board consists of volunteers who are unpaid. But there is a whole lot of professionals underneath that, including teachers in special schools who are professionals and should be recognised and remunerated as professionals. As Singaporeans, we must be willing to donate and, when we donate, accept that a significant proportion of our donations will flow to these professionals who are doing good work.

So it is a combination of things which I need to do. It is not just a matter of putting in more money, but education,

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persuasion and really trying to elevate the sector in a sustainable way. Again, I have no illusions that this is going to be difficult, but I think it can be done and should be done, and we will have, in the long run, a more sustainable and high-quality sector. And that is what so many people have been asking for. Many, many times, Ms Denise Phua will come here and say, we want higher standards, we want qualified people, we want to do all the things that we want to do in our heart. Sometimes, they are limited. Sometimes, it is funding but, as I said just now, I do not think funding is the key limiting factor. I hope that by better organisation, we can achieve all this.

Dr Fatimah Lateef: Madam, I am glad to hear the Minister of State mention that we will go all out to help the destitute in our community. I am wondering whether we have any estimates of the number of destitutes we have in Singapore.

As a follow-up to last year's debate where I brought up the fact that the destitute hotline was not responded to throughout the whole weekend, I would like to update the Ministry that the response is extremely good now and they will come and pick up your destitute within one to two hours at any location upon calling the hotline, which is very well-manned today.

Mrs Yu-Foo Yee Shoon: Thank you for the compliment. My staff should be quite happy. They have all worked very hard. The Minister asked them to work 24/7 on the phone.

Coming to destitutes, we mentioned that the Ministry will emphasise on the lower 20th percentile, who are the low-income group. For the low-income group, we have a few schemes, not just for the destitute but also the marginal cases. We have made changes to various schemes to

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help them. With these revisions and new schemes, they will be covered under one of them.

Ms Denise Phua Lay Peng: Madam, just a number of clarifications and to complete my cut.

The Chairman: It will be a clarification, Ms Phua.

Ms Denise Phua Lay Peng: I want to thank the Minister, his MOS, PS and team really for this thankless task of adjusting to the needs of so many people, different types of clientele. Thank you very much.

Madam, the public would like to know if the Public Assistance quantum would be pegged to an inflation index. Can the Minister also consider having a focused team that eyeballs the Enabling Master Plan and probably give a more regular update on the progress since many people were consulted in crafting it?

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: Madam, the cash quantum of the Public Assistance scheme will remain under review. We will have to adjust and respond to the prevailing situation. Will we index it to inflation? I am not keen to take a categorical position on this because, when we say inflation, the first question we have to ask is: which index are we using? Are we sure our index is relevant to the population that we are dealing with? The inflation rate generally is different for people at the top 20% versus the lower 20% and, even within the lower 20%, it is different for the people on Public Assistance.

So I would prefer my current approach, which is to know who we are dealing with. We have 3,000 families, understand what their actual needs are, ie, what food, accommodation, utilities, rental, etc, keep watching the costs from the bottom up, and then do a reality check. That is how I am approaching it.

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That is why, like I said, I made my staff go shopping at FairPrice and show me a basket of food. They almost wanted to bring it to Parliament. But I thought that would be too gimmicky. But the point is that I am doing a ground-up approach to making sure that our people do not go hungry. And those of you who know me will know that that is something I feel very, very deeply about. So, I will give her that assurance.

Mr Zaqy Mohamad: Madam, I would like to thank the Minister-in-charge of Muslim Affairs for outlining MUIS' outreach programmes to counter self-radicalisation and our inter-faith efforts. Could the Minister comment if MUIS or the Malay community has been over-reacting, given the recent self-radicalisation in the Mas Selamat's case? I personally would have loved that the security issues of self-radicalisation be addressed as part of the MHA's cuts. But, in this case, would it seem as though we are making the national security issue a Malay/Muslim issue? Some of those I spoke to, eg, religious and Malay community leaders, feel that it may put the Malay community on the defensive if we over-react.

Assoc. Prof. Dr Yaacob Ibrahim: Madam, I am not sure whether we are over-reacting. But I agree with him that, in the case of Mas Selamat Kastari, it is a national security issue. DPM Wong is on top of the situation, together with the security agencies. But, as he has mentioned, he welcomes all efforts by all sectors of the community, of all races, to try and help out, in terms of disseminating the information.

In terms of radicalisation, we recognise that there are roles in which the Malay community can play because, this phenomenon, unfortunate though it may be, is happening within the Malay/Muslim community and, therefore, we have a certain amount of responsibility to ensure

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that our young are not led astray. So, in terms of encouraging our young to go to the right sources to make sure they are not misled, I think we have a very important role to play.

But in terms of dealing with the direct security threat, it has to be a national effort, and we play our role as Singaporeans.

Dr Lily Neo: Madam, could I seek the Minister's elaboration on my question earlier on the safety net for the most disadvantaged families of our society, especially their children, for the opportunity of levelling up? Could these families be given a package for the purpose of human capital development? The other issue is on the better MCYS delivery systems of the various schemes.

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: Madam, that is a big question! If Members do not mind, I forgot to respond to Ms Denise Phua's second question, which is on the Enabling Master Plan. We have actually accepted all the recommendations, except for one, which we will have to modify a bit but which we are working on now. So, the Member will see there is progress on the Enabling Master Plan, and I will get my staff to update her. If at any time the Member feels that the progress is unnecessarily tardy, please let me know. But we are fully committed to making it happen.

Let me now move on to children. I said it is a big question because it was actually meant to be a key theme of this year's COS. I started off with the story of my grandmother being a widow with three kids and about how, through family support, hard work and education, the family made good. This has always been on my mind when I deal with a low-income family, when I see a single parent or a disadvantaged kid. If he studies and works hard, will he become a doctor or a teacher? What will happen to the

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grandchildren of this widow or low-income family? These are real questions, and many Members have also referred to the question of social mobility.

So, let us exercise our minds on this issue. How do we make sure that these kids can escape the poverty trap? The first thing, I would say, is that we have to start working with the families. Are there two parents? Are the parents committed? So, where both parents are available and the marriage has got problems, we need to have counselling and provide services and facilities so that the couple can work at it. Because the most important thing a parent can do for a child is to love the mother or the father. There is a whole slew of services which Mdm Yu-Foo Yee Shoon mentioned on marriage counselling, etc. If we think about it, that actually is also directed at children.

Next, they need to have food on the table, a roof over their heads and a safe environment. And that means providing rental, housing, making sure the lights are on, that they do not get disconnected unless the parents are really playing games with Singapore Power. But, nowadays, because of the pay-as-you-use meter scheme, there is actually no reason for any house to be disconnected. So, that is another example of the things that we need to do, ie, the physical environment in the home.

Then, we need the kids to go to school or, if they are younger, we need them to go to kindergartens, and those younger than that, to the childcare centres. And that is where we see our whole host of schemes – Healthy Start, the Centre-based Financial Assistance scheme for Childcare (CFAC), KiFAS, and the universal childcare subsidy.

I can honestly tell you, a low-income family can get a child put into childcare for a

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negligible sum of money because all these schemes are available to kick in.

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But there are two reasons why we want the child to go into institutional childcare. First, is that we want to give the child better and, hopefully, more stimulating environment for his or her cognitive, emotional and social development. The other equally important reason is we want to enable the mother to go out to work because we believe an independent woman earning money and able to go out to work without having to worry about her children at home will be in a more stable and secure position - for herself, for her sake as well as to look after the children.

Having got the children into school, we then also recognise that not all families have the same starting line as far as school readiness is concerned. That is where MOE comes in. That is where learning support programmes can come in. That is actually where streaming should come in. I know streaming has been a controversial topic and people have lamented the problems with implementation of streaming. But actually streaming, if we go back to its original intent which is to customise and tailor-make the programmes to fit the interests and abilities of the child, if that is done correctly and properly, we again enable children to level up. Then we need to make sure that throughout the school system, scholarships, bursaries and the rest are in place so that the lack of money will never be a limiting factor to the academic advancement of the child.

Beyond that, in the workplace, we have got to make sure the economy grows. We have got to make sure jobs are available. That is why MOM has been all these years making sure that there are both economic growth and job growth, and what NTUC is doing to making sure

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that those jobs are high value-added jobs, jobs worth doing so that people can get jobs. Fortunately for us, one problem which we do not have is significant youth unemployment. If you go to Europe, if you go to other countries with rigid labour laws, you will see significant youth unemployment, and we do not have that in Singapore.

Going on, the rest of the stuff that we have done now, CPF LIFE and preparing for retirement, all that is, again if you stop to think about it, something which benefits young people because it means the young people of Singapore today will not be saddled with a high tax bill later on because we have ensured that every generation earns and saves enough for itself.

So, I will give Members the assurance that there is no quick fix. But if you stop to look at the complete picture of what Singapore has achieved, I believe we do have a good and secure, fair and equitable social safety net which will enable these children to fulfil their potential and lead full and dignified lives.

Mr Sin Boon Ann: Madam, I am heartened to know that there are so many schemes available to help the poor and needy families, in particular the children. I think what is of concern at this moment is: are these families and children slipping through the net? We have the family service centres, the VWOs, we have CDCs doing their good work. And very often in our MPS cases, when we write to family service centres, we get replies that say, "We know this family, they need financial assistance. We referred them to the CDCs and we provided them with temporary pocket money from the Straits Times Pocket Money Fund." Perhaps the Minister can enlighten me whether there is any particular agency that can take ownership of a particular case and see through this family from A to Z, be it in the form of getting the father a job,

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getting the child placed in school and ensuring that the child stays in school, and providing the proper counselling so that on a holistic basis we can provide a more comprehensive and thorough assistance, and eye-balling the family as it were, to see the family through. I think this is the critical issue that we are confronted with.

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: I agree with the Member that we need to make sure nobody slips through the net. But one point I want to emphasise, which is a point I said before, many people have asked us who owns the problem. That is the point at which I want to put up a barrier. I believe we must own our own problems, and I believe families must take ownership. So I am not willing to have a system in which the State and all the VWOs become a surrogate husband or surrogate father.

But having said that, there is still a lot more that we can do. I will give a few examples. We have established the ComCare database so that all the different agencies who are involved in the family will be able to assess and share data. And we know, how many children are there, which schools they are in, what they are short of, what is the situation – the socio-economic and job status of the parents, and how they can be helped.

That is also why we are looking, and some of you have asked, for case managers. We are gingerly and carefully looking at that. To be honest with you, for most families who are at greatest risks, we do have case managers. But I do not want to make that the norm, that every family with any type of problem will require case management and, worse, be in a position to relinquish ownership of the problem. So I prefer to take this position: where it is your problem, yes, we will help, but you must do something about it. You must ask and you must do your bit as opposed to the other situation

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where we say, "Don't worry, we will look after everything for you – do it all!" And, unwittingly, you become the surrogate father, the surrogate husband, the surrogate family. And that may work in a quick fix and that may salve our guilty complex initially but I strongly fear that is the wrong road to take.

So we will have to take this balance of keeping some pressure on families, on individuals to exercise responsibility whilst, at the same time, making sure that the aspects of our social safety net that should respond should react. For instance, when Dr Fatimah Lateef says, "Why didn't your destitute hotline work?", I have no excuse. I have got to make sure it works because it is supposed to work. When a VWO says they need to know whether the children have dropped out of school, my system now must work so that I can tell them straightaway.

Similarly, the assessment of needs done at the CDCs. We have been on the CDCs' back to say that we want them to complete the evaluation as quickly as possible. And we track their KPIs for that instance. So what I am saying is that, yes, we do have all these different pieces of the net. We want to make sure they are responsive but I do not want to take ownership and say that the CDC owns the problem, the Mayor owns the problem, or the Chairman of the VWO owns the problem. Let us not go down that road.

But for really the most destitute and most hopeless cases, we will intervene and we will take them in. Let me share an email I received. This was a person – I think he is middle-age – who ran into some financial problem, having difficulties paying the mortgage, went to see his MP. The MP wrote to MCYS. Of course, in MCYS, our approach is – are you destitute? If you are destitute, we put you in Pelangi Home. The guy wrote back

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to me very angrily, "How dare you label me a destitute and offer me a place in your Pelangi Village?"

I stopped to think about it. What has happened to our expectations and our ownership of the problem? He expects us to provide accommodation compatible with what he is accustomed to. By the way, Pelangi Village still has vacancies, so I have no problems housing the destitutes. But every single family or almost every single family who has put up in a beach or in a park, when my officers go there and say, "Oh! You have a problem? We'll bring you in," they usually find some other alternatives with relatives and friends. So the truth of the matter is that people, unfortunately, sometimes would choose the path of least resistance. My job, unfortunately, is to put some resistors in the entire machinery so that people do not go down that path of least resistance and lead to abdication of responsibilities and abuse of resources.

We all start off with the best of intentions. Once we let our guard down, we end up in the road that we do not really want to travel. So there is always going to be for MCYS, this is our current mark. There will always be this push and shove between expectations and needs. I remember a point which Minister Mr Khaw Boon Wan said the other day: distinguish between needs and demand. The same principle in healthcare applies even to a greater extent in the social service sector.

Miss Penny Low: I agree with the Minister that the individual and family own the problem, but does the Minister also agree that sometimes it is the systemic failure of the system that cripples a person's ability and responsibility to function as a full contributing citizen of Singapore, and instead turning them into a social burden of some sort?

I mentioned an example during the main Budget speech, the story of Miss

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Judy Wee who is wheelchair bound and is otherwise intellectually as capable as any one of us. But unfortunately, every time she asks for a full contributing job, a meaningful job, she gets a marginalised job at a marginalised pay because of her physical condition. And recently, she has styled herself into a social entrepreneur as a barrier-free access consultant which, obviously, she is turning her disability into a special premium ability which I thought was laudable. Unfortunately, in my recent conversation with her, she mentioned that people, when they look at her, expect her to still perform it on a charitable basis or at very low fees because, they are doing it out of pity or not seeing her as full functioning as someone who looks mainstream, as someone who looks normal.

So my question is whether the Minister feels that there is a lot of room for us to highlight the abilities and to showcase the ability of some of the disabled population, the elderly population or even the stay-at-home mums who have got potential to become a full contributing citizen. And perhaps we should look into a systemic revamp of the legal and tax infrastructure to encourage the funding, the operation and kick-starting the social enterprise sector.

Dr Vivian Balakrishnan: I know Miss Judy Wee and she is right, she is as capable as any one of us except for her physical handicap. On a larger scale, we do want every disabled person to try to do a job which he or she is capable of, to fulfil her or his potential. But like she said, there are additional hurdles in their path. One scheme which my Ministry has worked on is what we call the Open Door Scheme and we have actually provided funds for them to modify their environment so that a person who is wheelchair bound or disabled will be able to work in that office. I visited a few companies with some intelligent planning and judicious use of these funds, they can create a situation in which the workplace

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enables people, even if they are disabled, to function fully or at least function as highly as their potential allows them to do so.

But having said that, this requires enlightened employers. I can provide the funds to say, "Yes, I will help subsidise your workplace renovations." But will the employers be bothered? We, as a matter of policy, have resisted passing labour laws and there are countries which put quotas – quotas on race, quotas on gender, quotas on disability, on companies.

In Singapore, and this is not just MCYS speaking, but as a Government, we have said that we need to keep our economy as agile, as flexible and as competitive as possible, and we will not have labour force rigidities. So we are not going to legislate quotas for the old, for the disabled, for gender or for race. But we will work on the much harder course of action, which is education, persuasion and helping create a situation which enlightens employers. Can we help to create open workplaces for people of all kinds?

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In the long run, this question of ageism, where people are unwilling to employ older workers, is something that we also have to resolve – it will work its way through the system. Because in a Singapore in which so many people are old, if we truly want talent, we are going to have to look beyond gender, beyond race, beyond physical handicap and beyond age. But it takes time. We have to keep pushing it. Again, what I am appealing, however, is – do not go for the short cut, which is to put quotas and assume that that will solve everything. I do not think that will work.

The Chairman: We have time for one or, at the very most, two more clarifications. Dr Maliki.

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Dr Mohamad Maliki Bin Osman: Madam, as a trained social worker and on behalf of the social fraternity, I would like to thank the Minister for really recognising the contribution of social workers in Singapore, and the need to educate Singaporeans on the role and contribution of social workers in Singapore. I assure the Minister and Members of the House that social workers will continue to serve with passion but, of course, a better remuneration package will be an added motivator.

My second point is that some Members have alluded to the importance of creating a caring culture in our Singapore society. I would like to ask MOS Yu-Foo whether the Ministry has any plans to facilitate such a development of a caring culture in our society.

Mrs Yu-Foo Yee Shoon: Madam, I would like to inform Dr Maliki that this initiative is by the people sector – the VWOs, the People's Association and also some MPs, like Dr Lim Wee Kiak, Mr Hawazi and others. I think we should develop it in that way. It is more the people themselves who feel that besides Government and CDCs' efforts, they should do something. Therefore, in Chinese, I say, hao ren hao shi, cong zhou bian zuo qi, which means good things or a little kindness starts from your surroundings. Having said that, my Minister has just approved a million dollars, as a gesture, to support this movement. But I would like to say that this is at a very early stage. The Ministry also needs to discuss this with the various agencies on how we can move together.

The Chairman: Mr Sin, do you wish to withdraw your amendment?

Mr Sin Boon Ann: Madam, I would like to thank the Ministers, MOS and the Parliamentary Secretary for their very comprehensive replies. Certainly, if we look at the efforts of the Government and,

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in particular MCYS, over the years, it would be very difficult to say that the Government does not have a heart. If I were poor, an elderly or a young Singaporean, I will be gratified to know that the Government is there to help us, and for the young to know that there is a great future ahead of us. I agree that the road to the future Singapore is challenging, and there are many more issues that we have to iron out, many more things that we have to do. But looking at the commitment of this present Government and the country as a whole, there is great hope for us. And I would like to congratulate the Government on the work well done and I believe that the Government will continue to press on to make Singapore an even better place for all Singaporeans.

On that note, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The sum of $1,177,933,100 for Head I ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $154,199,900 for Head I ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.