MAIN AND DEVELOPMENT ESTIMATES OF SINGAPORE FOR THE FINANCIAL YEAR 1ST APRIL, 1988 TO 31ST MARCH, 1989

Order read for consideration in Committee of Supply [6th Allotted Day].

[Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair]

Head M (cont.) -

Resumption of Debate on Question [22th March, 1988],

"That the sum to be allocated for Head M be reduced by $10 in respect of Code MC 1000 of the Main Estimates." - [Dr Ho Tat Kin.]

Question again proposed.

The Minister for the Environment (Dr Ahmad Mattar): Mr Chairman, Sir, when the House rose yesterday, we could only manage with very brief replies to points raised by the Member for Boon Teck and the Member for Changi, especially on matters pertaining to food hygiene and food handling. In particular, Sir, both Members would like to know whether my Ministry's current system of checking on these two very important aspects of public health is adequate.

Sir, I would like to take this opportunity to give them more detailed replies. Sir, every eating establishment and foodstall is checked at least once a month. Random food samples are taken for laboratory analyses. If a licensee or his foodhandler is found to commit an offence under our regulations, he will be ticketted and prosecuted in Court. Re-inspection will be made to ensure that corrective measures are taken and that the offence is not repeated.

Sir, under our regulations, offenders upon conviction are liable to a maximum fine of $500 for the first offence and a maximum fine of $1,000 for each subsequent offence. In addition, my Ministry, as we all know, has already implemented the Points Demerit System for food hygiene offences. A recalcitrant offender stands to have his licence suspended or even revoked if he accumulates a certain number of demerit points over a period of time.

Sir, another point I would like to stress is that all food vendors in Singapore are continuously educated on proper food and personal hygiene habits. Guidelines and pamphlets on these topics are handed out to them from time to time. So they should all know the requirements of the law. Those who are summoned are not ignorant of the law but are often the persistent offenders. Sir, I will certainly look into the Member for Boon Teck's proposal to blacklist food establishments with very poor food hygiene practices so that members of the public can avoid patronizing them.

I now turn to the Member for Yuhua. She is not here. The Member wants my Ministry to relax its restriction on the placing of tables and chairs outside the refreshment area of an eating shop along corridors or public concourses. Sir, five-foot ways, corridors or public concourses are for pedestrians and members of the public to use as accesses. These places are not intended for placing of tables and chairs for eating out. It is important, Sir, that some orderliness has to be maintained. But please do not get me wrong, Sir. My Ministry is not against dining out under the open skies, so to speak. But first of all, such refreshment areas must be planned as part of the licensed premises so that all the necessary facilities to be provided with outside refreshment areas could be considered at the planning stage. The outdoor refreshment area could then be licensed as part of the eating establishment.

Singapore is not the only country in the world with such strict laws, as the Member for Yuhua made it out to be yesterday. I know of at least three other countries - the United Kingdom, Australia and Japan.

Whilst still on the subject of hawkers, Sir, I would like to clarify why my Ministry is not prepared to consider allowing a hawker stall which is used only for part of the day to be rented out to another who wants to run it whenever it is not occupied. Sir, my Ministry does not think it feasible nor practicable for two licensees to share a stall as it may give rise to disputes. It is also difficult for us to determine which licensee should be held responsible if my Ministry finds the stall to be dirty and insanitary. It is because of these and other logistical problems that we are not allowing the sharing of stalls. But I am prepared to consider allowing sharing of stalls if a Town Council can convince me and my Ministry that there is no practical problem with such an arrangement and, more importantly, that public health standards are not compromised.

Finally, Sir, let me turn to the proposal put forth by the Member for Kaki Bukit. Sir, if we recall, the Member plans to carry out a carrot rather than the stick type of approach to solve littering problems in his constituency. In his scheme of things, Sir, the cleanest blocks in the constituency will be duly rocognised and plaques installed at lift landings of the blocks concerned. This, he said, would boost the morale of the residents of the block. Sir, I think the proposal by the Member for Kaki Bukit is a good one. The individual residents are involved and made aware of the advantages of keeping the environment clean. Sir, it is vital that residents of housing estates are proud of the environment they live in and help sustain the cleanliness of this environment through good personal habits. Their active participation, Sir, and cooperation is very important, otherwise our efforts to keep public areas clean and litter free will always be an uphill task. Sir, the proposal by the Member for Kaki Bukit will certainly complement the many talks, exhibitions and campaigns organized by my Ministry together with the HDB, the CCCs and the RCs to inculcate in the people the need to keep HDB housing estates clean. I will certainly encourage the Member to proceed with his proposal and, if successful, I will encourage the other constituencies to follow.

I am much obliged, Sir.

The Chairman: Mr Philip Tan, are you speaking?

Mr Philip Tan Tee Yong (Paya Lebar): Sir, I am glad that the Ministry of the Environment has made our housing estates cleaner and more hygienic as compared with the situation 10 years ago. However, Sir, this has unintentionally created a less vibrant housing estate. As you will probably know, if you go to many housing estates at night, it is a very dead situation. There have been many attempts to bring back life to the housing estates by the various grassroots organizations. Unfortunately, the activities cannot draw the bulk of people who prefer to stay indoors and watch television. May I suggest to the Minister a proven way in bringing back life to the housing estates, and this is in the form of the erstwhile pasar malam.

To me, I think, with the pasar malam, the human interaction will be greatly increased. This will supplement the other activities planned by the grassroots organizations. I would be happy to hear the Minister's comments on this.

The Senior Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for the Environment (Mr Eugene Yap Giau Cheng): Sir, pasar malam, as referred to by the Member for Paya Lebar, is commonly understood as the setting up of stalls by individuals on the streets, car parks and void decks. This is similar to street hawking. As a policy, the Ministry does not allow or encourage such activity. However, exceptions have been made for the Singapore Tourist Promotion Board to hold sales of goods for tourists at the Singapore River during festival periods. Permission was also given to STPB to hold sales of goods within the courtyard of the Singapore Handicraft Centre as this is not tantamount to street hawking.

Street hawking in HDB estates cannot be permitted. Besides, in HDB estates, there is really no need for pasar malam. The infrastructure of HDB estates is planned with supporting facilities such as shops, markets and food centres and in the newer estates supermarkets, neighbourhood stalls and specialty shops are provided. Facilities are therefore not lacking in HDB estates.

Mr Philip Tan Tee Yong: Sir, will the Senior Parliamentary Secretary agree that the reason for the Tourist Promotion Board in bringing the pasar malam to the riverside or to the Rasa Singapura was to bring back life to those areas? So is it not true that if you have pasar malam in the housing estates, social life will increase? I think we have got to measure the advantage of having social life with merely controlling the hawkers.

Mr Eugene Yap Giau Cheng: Sir, I agree with the Member for Paya Lebar that pasar malam has this potential of bringing life to an otherwise quiet, desolate place. But where HDB estates are concerned, I would have imagined that there is plenty of life around. So it is really not necessary to bring life back to HDB estates.

Mr Teo Chong Tee (Changi): Sir, I raised an issue yesterday with regard to the conversion of vacant market stalls into cooked food stalls, and I have not got an answer yet from either the Minister or the Senior Parliamentary Secretary.

Dr Ahmad Mattar: Mr Chairman, Sir, I must apologise to the Member for Changi for an oversight. Sir, the programme of converting vacant market produce stalls to cooked food stalls started in early 1981. This conversion was carried out to provide sufficient cooked food stalls for the resiting of licensed street hawkers and in this programme, Sir, some 398 vacant market produce stalls were converted to 153 cooked food stalls. This programme was completed last year.

Mr Philip Tan Tee Yong: Sir, I want to take up this issue again because the Senior Parliamentary Secretary used the word "quiet" and yet he says the HDB estates have enough infrastructure to serve them. Do you agree that in the housing estates at the moment now there is almost zero social life.

Mr Eugene Yap Giau Cheng: Sir, I cannot agree that there is zero social life in housing estates.

Mr Philip Tan Tee Yong: Almost zero.

Dr Ho Tat Kin (Boon Teck): Sir, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Mr Leong Horn Kee (Thomson): Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head M be reduced by $10 in respect of Code MC 5100 of the Development Estimates.

Sir, the Ministry of the Environment has done a very good job in keeping our island clean. Tourists have constantly praised Singapore as a clean and green city. In addition, after more than 10 years of hard work, the Ministry of the Environment has managed to clean up our rivers as well. Fishes and marine life are returning to the rivers.

I would like to ask the Minister whether his Ministry, having cleaned up the rivers, has any plans to move on to clean up the beaches. I feel that in tandem with having clean parks and rivers, we should also try to keep our beaches clean. Singapore does not have much of a countryside or scenic grounds to speak of. The beaches we have are some of the very few natural recreational grounds we have in our small island city state. I think they are very precious venues for family recreational outlets and they are popularly frequented by our people, especially during the weekends.

The littering of our beaches comes from both on-shore and off-shore sources so the monitoring control is very difficult. It is not a very pleasant experience if we find that we have to swim among debris and flotsam and when we get out of the water we are nicely covered with a very thin layer of oil slick. I would like to urge the Minister whether he could work together with other involved Government organizations to make a determined and concerted effort to keep our beaches clean.

Dr Ahmad Mattar: Mr Chairman, Sir, the cleanliness of our beaches is marred by three factors:

1. Driftwood, seaweed and debris that are continuously brought in by the tides;

2. Littering by picnickers, as mentioned by the hon. Member for Thomson, and users of the beach; and

3. Oil spills in the sea mainly as a result of accidents involving ships and tankers in our harbour area and shipping lanes.

Sir, the public beaches are cleaned daily. Each day, some 35 workers are deployed to clean up the driftwood and the litter left behind by picnickers. It is an onerous task and few appreciate the hard and back-breaking job which our workmen have to do to clear away the rubbish left behind on the beaches. Littering by picnickers and users of the beach is still rampant in spite of the numerous refuse bins provided along the beaches. My Ministry will be purchasing suitable beach cleaning machines to replace manual cleaning for certain stretches of the beach.

With regard to oil spills, Sir, the first strategy is to prevent the oil from reaching our shores. The PSA, assisted by oil companies and salvage companies, will attempt to prevent the oil spill from reaching the shores. However, in some cases, this is not possible if the spill is a large one. When the oil hits the beach, the cleaning-up is again an onerous task.

Members of the public have a role to play in keeping our beaches litter-free. I urge them to dispose refuse into bins provided. A beach free of litter will certainly be more pleasant than one strewn with rubbish.

Sir, my Ministry's long-term programme on the cleaning of beaches is geared towards total mechanization. For a start, we are proposing to buy three beach-cleansing machines for the 13 km stretch of East Coast Beach and the 10 km stretch of Changi Beach. Later, we will source small beach cleansing machines for the Pasir Ris, Changi Point and the Kallang Basin beaches.

Mr Leong Horn Kee: I see that the Minister is very keen on keeping our beaches clean. I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Dr Ho Tat Kin (Boon Teck): Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head M be reduced by $10 in respect of Code MF 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, diesel-driven vehicles such as taxis, lorries, buses and goods vehicles with excessive smoke emission represent a source of air pollution. Smoky vehicles emit soot particles and unburned hydrocarbons which are hazardous to health. Early last year, there were more smoky vehicles seen on the roads. I would like to ask the Minister what measures are taken to check and control vehicles with excessive smoke emissions.

I understand there are more than 473,000 diesel vehicles registered in Singapore. I would like to know what percentage of the number has been found to be emitting excessive smoke earlier last year and whether the situation has improved recently. I understand there are another 30,000 Malaysian diesel vehicles issued with entry permits to Singapore each year. As foreign vehicles are not subject to the same stringent inspection regulations we have for Singapore vehicles, I would like to know what percentage of Malaysian diesel vehicles coming into Singapore has been found to emit excessive smoke in Singapore roads. What action has been taken to reduce this number and is there any check done at the Causeway?

I would also like to find out from the Minister if the present system of imposing fines is a sufficient deterrent. How high are the fines in comparison with the fines for littering? Since smoke from diesel vehicles can be avoided if diesel engines are properly maintained and serviced, will it not be more effective if the fleet operators, such as SBS or NTUC Comfort and others are encouraged to commit their fleet to a proper and periodic maintenance programme either by persuasion or by regulations? Currently, the Ministry of the Environment and the Traffic Police are jointly involved in handling this problem. Is it necessary for two Government organizations to handle such problems? Will it not be more productive if just either one department is handling it?

Dr Ahmad Mattar: Mr Chairman, Sir, according to a survey conducted in January last year, about 19% of Singapore-registered diesel vehicles were found to be smoky. In a separate survey conducted in June last year, about 85% of Malaysian-registered diesel vehicles were emitting black smoke. My Ministry works with the ROV to step up enforcement on Singapore registered vehicles in April 1987. Between April and October 1987, a total of 7,067 vehicles were summoned by ROV for emitting black smoke. A second survey carried out in November last year showed that the number of Singapore-registered vehicles that were found to be emitting black smoke had dropped from 19% to 9%. Our enforcement efforts will continue.

Sir, enforcement against smoky Malaysian-registered vehicles was also stepped up in September 1987 with about 190 vehicles summoned each month. By November 1987, the number of smoky Malaysian-registered vehicles dropped from 85% to 24%. Enforcement and monitoring actions are still continuing.

Sir, my Ministry will continue to act against smoky vehicles on the road and will work with ROV to maintain the improvements that have been achieved. For the information of the Member for Boon Teck and for the information of this House, a joint Committee comprising officers from the Pollution Control Department of my Ministry, the Ministry of Communications and Information, the Ministry of Home Affairs, ROV, Traffic Police and the Ministry of Trade and Industry, was formed in 1987 to study measures to control smoky vehicles. The Committee is chaired by the Pollution Control Department of my Ministry.

Sir, various options are being considered by the Committee. The more significant ones include raising the fines for smoky vehicles. At present, Sir, the fine is $40 levied on both the owner and driver of the vehicle. Personally, I feel this fine is a bit too low. The Ministry of Communications and Information has agreed to raise the fine and is studying the amount by which it should be raised.

The second option is raising the smoke emission standard for vehicles. At present ROV considers a vehicle as being smoky if it emits smoke at a level exceeding 64 HSU (Hartridge Smoke Unit). ROV has agreed to gradually raise the standard to 54 HSU.

The third option, Sir, is raising the design specifications of new diesel engines before they are imported into Singapore. This proposal is still under study.

The fourth option, Sir, is to limit the life-span of specialized vehicles such as mobile cranes and recovery vehicles to 20 years. A life-span of 20 years and 7 years has already been imposed by ROV on goods vehicles and taxis respectively. On this fourth option, ROV has yet to agree with the proposal.

Dr Ho Tat Kin: Sir, I would not be raising the other issue on the cleanliness of Singapore River since the Minister has answered yesterday.

Sir, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The sum of $162,758,500 for Head M ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $296,762,000 for Head M ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.

Head Q -

The Chairman: Head Q, Ministry of Home Affairs. Amendment No. (1), 84 minutes. Mr Bernard Chen.

Mr Bernard Chen (Clementi): Sir, I beg to move,

That the total sum to be allocated for Head Q of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100.

Sir, with your permission, I would like to go over generally some of the functions carried out by the Singapore Police Force. The other members of my GPC would go into the details.

Sir, Singapore as a metropolis has enjoyed rather low crime rates compared to other cities in the world. Through the years, despite rapid economic development and social progress, Singapore has been able to keep these crime rates relatively to a minimum compared with other big cities in the world. But as in all things, times change, and we have to change along with them.

The first aspect that I would like to comment on is the kind of legislation that we have in force that enables the Police Force to implement or enforce law and order effectively. These legislations have to be refined, tightened and revised as times change. In the past two decades we have had occasions to do some of these major changes. For example, in the '50s and early '60s when kidnapping was rampant, we tightened the law considerably, and as a result kidnapping is now virtually a thing of the past. In the '70s we had the occasion to tighten our legislation on armed robbery and vandalism. And in '80s with more traffic, more cars and more serious accidents, we had also revised legislation on drunken driving and other offences on the roads. The latest, of course, is something that we have talked about, that is, the tightening of legislation on fireworks or discharging and procuring of fireworks.

Sir, one of the features of all these changes has been that we seem to move after the event rather than anticipating the manifestation of these adverse developments. The penalties imposed by the law are often inadequate to fit in with the seriousness of the crimes and many a time we seem to let the situation get a bit out of control before Parliament considers revisions to the Acts that would reduce the severity of these crimes. I would like to raise with the Minister whether, in fact, we can have a more systematic review of some of the legislations regarding the work of the Police Force with a view to seeing whether the provisions of the legislations are keeping up with the times, especially in areas where rapid economic and social developments have made some of these provisions obsolete. My GPC and members of the Resource Panel are more than happy to see in what way we can contribute to examine some of these legislations in depth and to arrive at a situation where the provisions are improved and adapted to the changing situation before they deteriorate. Because without adequate provisions of the law and legislation, the Police Force would be hampered in the carrying out of their duties.

Let me now move on to the enforcement by the Police themselves. As we have read in the press through the years, the mode of policing has been changing quite rapidly, and rightly so, as it responds to changing times and the movement of people to high-rise housing estates. So we see the police going from foot patrol to bicycle patrol, mobile patrol, Division headquarters, and lately the implementation of Neighbourhood Police Posts. All these changes are in keeping with the changing lifestyle of the people. The question to ask is whether, in fact, such changing policing lifestyles have been accompanied by the provisions of facilities and amenities to enable the Police to perform their duties more efficiently. In particular, we heard of computerization of records to enable Police to retrieve information rapidly, be they on duty in the stations or in mobile police cars. And with the fast response and better communications, one would imagine that the Police would be able to perform their duties more efficiently.

If we look at the Police Force and other statutory boards, a question may well be raised - whether the Police Force as a department has the same access to funds and resources that other statutory boards enjoy. For example, it is quite well known that Telecoms is providing first-class service to clients, both domestic and internationally. The Public Utilities Board, the PSA are doing the same. These statutory boards have more or less direct access to funds in their own respective organizations. The Police Force, under the Ministry of Home Affairs, has to go to the Ministry of Finance. Lest Members of the House think that we are speaking on behalf of the Ministry of Home Affairs to get more money from the Finance Ministry, it remains that the criteria for justifying some of these services are easily met or more easily met in the statutory boards than the Finance Ministry. If the guidelines are more flexible, one would imagine that the Police Force would spend more of their time enforcing law and order rather than fighting with the Ministry of Finance to get the necessary financial resources to upgrade their equipment.

In the recent past there are already signs that the Police Force has been able to perform much more efficiently if they are given the wherewithal. In our visits to police stations and the other establishments, GPC members are quite impressed that with proper equipment, up-to-date equipment, the efficiency of the Police Force can be enhanced quite tremendously. This point cannot be over-emphasized because as we improve efficiency, we will always be behind somewhat - the crooks and the rascals who have also access to equipment and facilities that are probably few years ahead of us. The question about bookies is a good example. We had a briefing and we saw some of the equipment that they used and I must say that their equipment I think are probably better than the ones we have in the Police Force. You cannot catch crooks that way if they are better off than you are.

The third area which I would like to comment really is with the legislation and better methods of policing and the complement of equipment facilities, amenities, the remaining component really is that of people. With the more sophisticated method of policing, one would imagine that we need more planners who can bring their minds to bear on how the changing environment, changing conditions will require a change in policing methods. They would need to know how best the more sophisticated criminals and crooks can be dealt with and how loopholes can be plugged. We cannot rely all the time on traditional policing methods that may have been good in the old days but are no longer relevant to the modern needs.

The Chairman: Order. Time is up.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee (Toa Payoh): Sir, I would like to touch on the recent review of manpower requirements in the Police Force conducted by an international firm of management consultants.

Here I would like to support the views expressed by the Member for Clementi who is the GPC Chairman for the Ministry of Home Affairs. The question I would like to ask is: are the recommendations in line with the Government's objective in manpower reductions in the Civil Service? If this is so, will this lead to a decrease in efficiency and effectiveness in the policing system?

Singapore is one of the few countries with a very low crime rate. This is in no small measure due to an efficient and forward-looking Police Force. We must recognize the fact that in an affluent and modern society, criminal activities tend to increase and become more sophisticated. Besides, there will be an increase in the range of policing functions to cope up with in a modern and progressive society. In addition to the manpower requirements of the Police Force, the Ministry of Home Affairs has also taken into consideration the manpower requirements of other enforcement agencies like Drug Enforcement and Civil Defence. Therefore, there is a need to examine carefully the manpower needs of our Police Force and other specialized functions and agencies of the Ministry of Home Affairs. We must avoid the danger of adopting a penny-wise pound-foolish policy at the expense of lowering the efficiency and effectiveness of our Police Force and other enforcement agencies in the Ministry.

Finally, may I ask the Minister whether the crime situation is under control in Singapore?

The Chairman: Mr Cheong, Encik Zulkifli is not here. Would you like to move on to your next subject?

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, although the Traffic Police has reported a considerable drop in serious road accidents, they must continue with the stepping up of road traffic enforcement. There are motorists who habitually flout even the most basic regulations. They ignore yellow box junctions, turning left or right from the wrong lanes, parking their vehicles close to major road junctions and littering on roads and expressways. Although offences like driving against red traffic lights have decreased due to the installation of surveillance cameras at certain road junctions, the offences which I have quoted can cause serious road accidents if stiffer penalties are not imposed.

Sir, there are a number of goods vehicles on our roads. Very often, the goods section of these vehicles are not properly covered or the goods carried are not properly secured. One can find bags, containers and, on one occasion, I observed a ladder had fallen onto an expressway. Vehicles along expressways travel at a much higher speed and the things that have fallen off from such vehicles can pose a serious hazard to other roadusers.

Sir, the next point I would like to raise is whether the Traffic Police together with other relevant Government departments could look into the possibility of improving or installing more road signs along major roads and expressways. Such signs should indicate well in advance the names of roads and places of interest to enable motorists to take advance precaution.

Finally, I would like to ask the Minister whether there is any coordination between the Traffic Police and the Divisional Police Stations in keeping records of serious road accidents resulting in serious injuries. Recently I came across two instances where records of serious road accidents kept by the Traffic Police were at variance with those at the Divisional Police Headquarters.

Sir, failure to report serious road accidents can invalidate insurance claims for compensation by victims of road accidents. Here, I would like to declare my personal interest on this matter as my daughter was involved in a very serious road accident and broke her arm. She spent two weeks in hospital. When my solicitors wrote to the Traffic Police and asked for details of the accident, they received a notice, after paying for the cost, saying that there was no trace of this accident. I persevered in this and managed to find a report lodged with the Beach Road Police Station that indeed there was an accident.

The second accident involved one of my constituents about eight years ago. It was a serious accident and he fractured his skull. He spent 2 1/2 months in hospital. When his lawyers sought information from the Traffic Police, he received the same reply, although in the report it was stated that the Police had records of the driver of the vehicle. The point I wish to make is: why were these people not prosecuted if they had failed to make a police report of the serious traffic accidents in which they were involved? May I ask the Minister to seriously look into this problem?

The Minister for Home Affairs (Prof S. Jayakumar): Sir, I will respond to the broad points on policing raised by the Member for Clementi who is the Chairman of the GPC on Home Affairs and also raised by the Member for Toa Payoh. My colleague, the Minister of State, will respond to the points on Traffic Police raised by the Member for Toa Payoh.

If I may take the points that they have raised in some systematic order. First, can I refer to the point raised by the Member for Toa Payoh who asked if I could give some indication as to whether the crime situation is under control? Members will know that the Police have, on a quarterly basis, been giving information on crime statistics and I have encouraged them to be quite open about the statistics, whether they go up or down. I am glad to say, Sir, that the crime situation is under control. Major crimes such as murder, rape, outraging of modesty in 1987 decreased compared to the previous year. Other offences, like housebreaking, showed only very slight increases.

What is very significant is that although more than 80% of our population live in HDB flats, the majority of housebreaking cases occurred outside HDB areas. In other words, less than 50% of the housebreaking cases involve HDB estates, which is very significant because it speaks volumes for the community policing and crime prevention awareness on the part of the people living in HDB estates.

Lift robberies which I highlighted last year in the Committee of Supply as a worrying problem showed a reduction in 1987 by more than 24%. And the number of robberies generally in public housing estates has come down.

Moving from the general crime situation to the points raised by the Member for Clementi. First, he made the point that we should systematically and periodically review legislation as they affect crime and as they affect policing. I take his point and would like to assure him and other Members that this is being done. Both the Ministry and the Police periodically review legislation to assess whether the provisions are adequate and if any amendments are needed. Apart from the examples that he has given, he might recall that only a few years ago, we made major amendments to the Penal Code and the Criminal Procedure Code to review the range of penalties. Secondly, new legislation was introduced a few years ago to combat the problem of mini turf clubs, particularly in public housing estates.

While I accept the need for periodic review of legislation, we can only come to this House for changes to the legislation on the basis of facts and data on which to make a case for change to the legislation, particularly where we want to increase penalties. Although the Member for Clementi pointed out that we should not wait till after the event, it would be very difficult to come to this House and persuade Members to vote in favour of changes to legislation for increase of penalties if I do not present the House with facts and figures to show that there is a trend, a negative trend or an adverse trend, which warrants tightening up of the legislation. But I would welcome the offer made by the Chairman of the GPC that the GPC members will assist the Police in reviewing these areas of legislation which may require reform and amendment.

Secondly, his point on computerization and equipment is a valid one, particularly in the light of manpower review. For Police manpower like manpower of all other Government departments, is limited. And the limited manpower has to cater for a variety of departments and a variety of policing functions, from crime prevention to neighbourhood police posts, land divisions, marine police, police task force, traffic police and many others. So it means that the challenge for the Police is, first, the manpower problem means that they must be a trim, lean and efficient organization where maximum use is made of every member of the Police Force. The Police are aware of this. Secondly, it also means that wherever possible, there has to be better mechanization and computerization. And, third, it must also mean that the Police must strive to get the best quality of recruits for its Force.

With respect to computerization, I would like to assure the Member for Clementi and other Members that indeed computerization is well under way. The computerization of the Police Operations Room and the CID is in progress. If I may give an example, Sir, of how computerization is going to significantly affect policing methods and is going to benefit law enforcement, I give the example of the Automated Fingerprint Identification System (AFIS) for which approval by the Ministry of Finance has been given and tenders are being called for.

Sir, the CID has about 240,000 fingerprint records. But because the search and the retrieval is manual, it means, first, that for any particular set of fingerprints which we want to match, it is impossible manually to match against the entire records. And more often than not, we are able to manually match against about 8% of the 240,000 records and this will take sometime between 7 days and 21 days. With the automated fingerprint identification system, we will be able to match a finger print lifted at the scene of a crime with the entire records that we have and in a matter of minutes. In fact, in other countries where they have introduced computerized finger print identification systems, the identification rate rose remarkably. In Tokyo, for instance, the identification rate rose from 75 to more 1,000. And immediately when they introduced their system, within hours they identified and solved a case which had remained unsolved for 15 years. I cite this as one illustration of how computerization is going to tremendously aid policing, crime prevention and law enforcement.

With regard to the point that the Member has made about manpower and funds, of course, Sir, one would like the ideal of having as free an access to funds as possible and as flexible a situation as the statutory boards enjoy. And I am sure the Police and my Ministry officials will be gladdened to hear the quite unsolicited support that the Member for Clementi has given. But to be fair to the Ministry of Finance, whenever we have a case which is convincing, I find the Minister for Finance willing to listen and to give his serious consideration, as in the case of the Automated Finger Print Identification System which will cost more than $10 million.

The Member for Clementi talked about legislation. In my response to his point on legislation, I must also add that legislation is only a means whereby the Police are able to enforce the law. But legislation, manpower of the Police, computerization, hardware, weapons, these are all one side of what I would call the two-pronged approach of the Police. The other prong which we must continue to stress is the support by the people and by the community. It is only when the Police succeeds in getting the support of the people in the community-oriented policing that the detection of criminals is that much more certain. Here too, I am very glad to say that the trend over the years shows that more and more people are coming forward to support the Police. Last year the number of cases which was solved and the number of arrests which were made with the assistance of the public continued to rise, and the number of arrests with the support of the public rose to 37%, which is a very commendable figure. Not only that, we are also seeing increasing evidence that the victims of crime are more prepared to come forward to give information to the Police. This is absolutely important if the Police are to speedily respond and arrest offenders.

If I may give an example, Sir. Members must have read recently that a male suspect had been arrested for possible involvement in four rape cases. Without going into the merits as to his guilt or otherwise, which is not proper to do so, let me use this as an illustration. Four rape cases were reported to the Police and all these cases were suspected to have been committed by the same person. In all the four cases, the victims made prompt reports. Each victim painstakingly gave a description of the culprit which enabled the Police to construct a composite photokit of the culprit. Then the Organized Crime Branch of the CID deployed its officers at strategic locations in order to apprehend the culprit. Even more interesting, Sir, in spite of the traumatic experience, one of the victims volunteered to accompany the Police officers during such deployment, as she could then help pick out the offender. I cite this illustration because more often than not crimes may not be reported by the victims. If they do not report, it means that the culprit is free to perpetrate his activities elsewhere and others will become victims. Second, when they report, as much detailedinformation supplied to the Police will help to solve the case.

To sum up then, Sir, the crime situation is under control. Police, because of limited manpower, will emphasize high efficiency and optimum use and deployment for all the various functions, and greater emphasis will be given to mechanization and computerization. But while doing all this, the Police must continue to strive to get public support and community support.

The Minister of State for Home Affairs (Dr Lee Boon Yang): Sir, may I respond to the remarks made by the Member for Toa Payoh.

Sir, I agree with the Member that the Traffic Police must continue to carry out enforcement and control measures in order to make our roads and expressways safe for all users. The Member gave a number of examples of offences that one still can encounter on the roads. In particular, he spoke about the danger posed by loads on goods vehicles being improperly secured. He cited the case of a ladder having fallen onto the road. I agree wholeheartedly with the Member that all road users, particularly drivers of goods vehicles, must take every precaution to ensure that they are not a hindrance to other road users or that they pose an unnecessary danger to other road users. Drivers of goods vehicles should ensure that their loads are properly secured because loads that are not properly secured are dangerous not only to other road users but also to the drivers themselves. Besides the potential hazard posed to other road users, loads that have fallen off have to be removed from the road. In the case of certain substances that have fallen off, the road has to be cleaned up and this will cause delay and inconvenience to other road users.

Sir, the Traffic Police has always taken a serious view of this type of offence. There are at least three rules in the Motor Vehicles Rules and the Road Traffic Rules which prescribe penalties for carrying improperly secured loads. Penalties of fines up to $1,000 or imprisonment up to three months can be imposed. Drivers who carry improperly secured loads are also liable to four demerit points under the Road Traffic (Demerit Points) Rules. Sir, the enforcement measures carried out by both Traffic Police and ROV officers have kept the number of injury accidents caused by unsecured loads falling off goods vehicles to a very low level. In fact, in 1986 there were four cases of accidents caused as a result of loads falling off a vehicle. In 1987 there was only one case. At the same time the Traffic Police have also been stringently enforcing these rules and the number of offences of such a nature have come down over the years. The number of cases that they have encountered and have taken action has increased as a result of their more stringent enforcement of the rules. For example, in 1986, there were 214 cases of drivers carrying loads not properly secured which were detected and action taken by the Traffic Police. In 1987, there were 218. In the case of the offence of carrying loads in a dangerous manner, in 1986 there were 39 cases detected, and in 1987 47 cases were taken to task.

Sir, this result does not mean that enforcement will be relaxed in the future. On the contrary, the Traffic Police and ROV officers will continue to be vigilant and to be on the look-out for such offenders. They will take a two-pronged approach, both education and enforcement. This will help to prevent the problem from getting out of hand and to minimize the number of such accidents or incidents in the future. The Police is also considering whether or not to introduce demerit points for drivers of such vehicles under the Road Traffic Rules, as a further deterrent. Let me assure the Member for Toa Payoh that the Traffic Police will continue to enforce the rules on proper carriage of goods to minimize the danger and congestion posed by drivers who habitually do not make an effort to secure their goods or loads.

Sir, the Member for Toa Payoh also asked whether there is coordination between the Police Divisional Headquarters and the Traffic Police in methods and in the handling of accident reports, particularly in a serious accident where there is injury. The answer is yes, there is an established procedure to coordinate the handling of accident reports between Divisional HQ and the Traffic Police. I share the Member's concern that there have been examples of cases where reports apparently have not been transmitted to Traffic Police. I will certainly ask Police and the Traffic Police to investigate the two examples given by the Member for Toa Payoh. If the causes of these examples were human errors, then appropriate action will be taken. If they were the result of procedural deficiency, let me assure the Member that we will take prompt action to rectify these procedures and to improve it so that in future all reports will be handled expeditiously.

Mr Bernard Chen: Sir, just now the Minister mentioned the problem of equating the reduction of manpower as part of Government policy and automation and computerization. I just want to add one point. In respect of the Police Force, it is not just good enough to have graduates who are good planners and enforcers. Sometimes it is hard for a graduate Police officer to apprehend a crook somewhere in the streets. We have in the Police Force a core of very dedicated junior officers, sergeants maybe, or corporals even, who seem to have a good sense of who the crooks are and where they are. It would be a pity if, in the course of trimming manpower, we let this category go. In the case of the Police Force, I think we should not just go on the basis of qualifications. I think we should go for the special qualities that some of these Police officers have. I think many Members of the House who have experience with some of these dedicated junior officers will agree with me that we need to retain, if not look after, this particular group of people because with the kind of crooks and rascals that we have, we need people who are better than them to apprehend them. I hope the Minister will consider this point.

Prof. Jayakumar: Sir, I could not agree more with what the Membe r for Clementi has said. Indeed that is the approach of the Police - that while you do have the scholars, and there are scholarships given by PSC for local tertiary education as well as overseas scholarships for the Police Force, we must be concerned with the overall quality of the entire establishment which means that we not only try to get better recruits into the Police Force but, once they are recruited, then after they have joined the Police Force, the Police must have the ability to sift the better ones, the more enterprising, the more talented, and put them on a career path which will eventually over the years ensure that the leadership in the Police Force will be good and the same standards of policing and law enforcement which we have now are ensured for the coming decade.

The Chairman: You want to move on to your next subject, Mr Chen?

Mr Bernard Chen: Sir, on the problem of drug abuse, I would just like to draw a parallel between the heroin drug addiction that we are used to face in the past decade and the growing incidents of glue-sniffing that they are encountering in this decade. The three major cornerstones to the success of our anti-drug drive in the last decade have been really the following. First, a very effective deterrent against drug trafficking to the extent of mandatory death sentence for people who carry more than 15gm of heroin. The second being a constant monitoring of the drug addicts, including regular urine tests and inspection of the haunts that they frequent, and the third being a very intensive rehabilitation programme which has at least achieved a rather high success rate.

I am afraid to say that in the case of glue-sniffing these three conditions that have been applied rather successfully to heroin addiction may not apply to the same extent. Firstly, on trafficking. As against heroin, glue-sniffing is different in that there are many forms of inhalants that one can buy in the streets. Many of them are being used commercially for other purposes. It is extremely difficult to isolate or even more difficult to restrict the sales of these inhalants as against the sale of heroin.

Secondly, the profile of addicts is somewhat different from those of heroin. In the case of heroin addicts, I understand the average age of these addicts is somewhat higher whereas in inhalant addicts they are mostly teenagers, sometimes even down to the 15's and 16's and it is difficult to keep track of these people, even harder to educate them on the follies of inhalant abuse.

Thirdly, the rehabilitation efforts that apply to heroin addiction may also have to be different. In the case of heroin addiction, more severe methods can be used because a large proportion of these addicts would have reached 21 years old and they know what they are in for. The teenagers, sometimes because they got mixed up with bad companies or they themselves are not sufficiently matured to realize the implication of inhalant abuse, would have to be treated quite differently.

The legislation regarding glue-sniffing was passed sometime in the course of last year. I would just like to find out from the Minister whether any progress has been made in the implementation of these measures that the Ministry of Home Affairs has announced, whether the incidence of inhalant abuse has deteriorated or whether some of the provisions provided in the law are adequate to cope with the problem and whether the campaign to educate the public, in particular, the parents of these inhalant abusers, have had any success so far.

Mr Chew Heng Ching (Kaki Bukit): Sir, the law relating to the arrest and treatment of inhalant abusers under the Intoxicating Substances Act passed in the House last year is confined to basically three categories of people: (a) inhalant abusers arrested in the act; (b) if a person is not seen sniffing glue but there are symptoms or proof to suggest that the abuse of inhalant has taken place recently; (c) the glue-sniffer is below 21 years of age and where the parents or the guardians submit an application for him to be treated.

Sir, the law excludes persons above 21 years of age not belonging to category (a) or (b) and who do not volunteer for treatment even though they are glue-sniffers. It is quite understandable that a person, being above 21 years of age, has the right to decide what is good for himself, whether or not he wants to be treated. But one must remember that a glue-sniffer, under the strong influence of glue, is often not in the best position to think rationally what is best for himself.

Sir, I am moving this cut in response to a recent experience encountered by a constituent of mine. He is a glue-sniffer, 25 years of age. He is aware of his own plight, aware of his own problems. The family members are sympathetic towards him and wanted him to be treated and cured. He agreed with the family members that he should be treated. But on the day he was supposed to be sent to the Falkland Centre for treatment, he thought otherwise. There was a medical certificate from a general practitioner and, as the MP, I wrote a letter to the Director, Falkland Centre, to say, "Please treat this case." But this person refused to give consent for himself to be treated. This is the plight of this person and the plight of his family members. This may be an isolated incident but I think it has policy implications on the way the Intoxicating Substances Act is to be implemented.

May I therefore suggest to the Minister that he consider either reviewing the law or to implement the Act more flexibly so as to allow those glue-sniffers above 21 years of age to be treated as long as parents, guardians or even the next-of-kin give consent for them to be treated. He may not volunteer but as long as there is enough evidence, a medical certificate from a doctor and other evidence to show that he is a glue-sniffer, I think the Falkland Centre should consider his case favourably. I would like the Minister to consider this recommendation.

Mr Heng Chiang Meng (Jalan Kayu): Sir, actually I submitted two cuts under this particular drug enforcement topic and so I beg your indulgence if I exceed my time. But, nevertheless, I will try to be as speedy as possible.

The Chairman: We are running out of time, Mr Heng.

Mr Heng Chiang Meng: Sir, the control of drug abuse by the Ministry of Home Affairs usually falls into three broad categories:

1. Cutting off the supply of drugs;

2. Elimination of demand by users through a host of educational and social programmes, police supervision and such like; and

3. When these two areas fail and the person becomes an addict, then when the addict is apprehended, a programme of rehabilitation is the third stage in the war against drugs.

Sir, I have no complaints against these series of measures by the Ministry of Home Affairs except that - I will bring it up later - I have a suggestion to reinforce the measures in the first category. But now, Sir, I think that the combat against drugs is not simply just a matter of the Ministry alone but I would like to stress to this House, especially some of the Cabinet Ministers, that the war against drugs is also the responsibility of the Government in particular and society in general. That is why, Sir, I think what is missing from the three-pronged attack is a fourth area, that of post-rehabilitation.

Sir, what do I mean by post-rehabilitation? I would like to ask: what happens when an addict successfully completes a programme at the drug rehabilitation centre and becomes an ex-addict? Surely, Sir, the purpose of all that the Ministry has done up to this point in the DRC is to help the drug addict to kick the habit, to kick the addiction, so that he can once again become a useful member of society. But then what happens when such a person tries to fit back into society? Obviously, the first thing he tries to do is to get a job but unfortunately the profile of the addict is usually that of a person of low education and low skills and employment available to him is usually in the areas where Government approval is a pre-requisite.

Sir, let me explain. A person has certain skills, he gets a job. But sometimes certain jobs require approval by the Government authorities. Let me illustrate. If this ex-addict wants to be a taxi driver, a bus driver, a school bus driver or even if he wants to be a driver to transport workers to and from their place of work and home, he has to get a vocational driving licence from the ROV which is a special licence given to a person to do a job, a vocation. If he wants to be a hawker, he needs a permit or he needs a stall from the Hawkers Department. Even if he wants to be a despatch driver for a private sector com- pany and his job requires him to go into areas such as the airport, the PSA and what the various Government authorities call "sensitive areas", whatever that means, he requires a permit too. I could go on with more examples. But what I have just said should be sufficient.

If the fact that the applicant is an ex-addict is not considered in determining his suitability in the granting of these licences and permits, then I can say at least the Government is sincere in its attempts to rehabilitate these unfortunate citizens. However, although I cannot say for some of the other departments, I know that it is a policy of the Registry of Vehicles not to grant any form of vocational driving licence to those with drug records. Sir, before you rule me out of order and say this should be brought up under the Ministry of Communications and Information, let me say that I am only bringing up the ROV example and the policy as an illustration. The question that still remains is whether other authorities have such similar policies.

But the point is that if, due to all these official policies, not of the Home Affairs Ministry but of the other Government authorities, the ex-addict becomes an addict again - and speaking to those who have gone through this, it is very easy in times of stress for an ex-addict to become an addict again - then the problem obviously reverts to the Home Affairs Ministry. Hence, I would like the Minister for Home Affairs to consider this suggestion, ie, to establish and head an inter-ministry committee to examine this problem of rehabilitation.

The drug addict is not a criminal, Sir, and should not be treated as such. If the Government expects society to treat these unfortunate people sympathetically, the Government must first take the lead. The policies of some departments, I am afraid, are obviously not encouraging in this aspect.

Sir, coming back to the issue of cutting off the supply of drugs to the market, I must admit that in Singapore we have one of the best systems in the world not only in enforcement measures but also in legislating the death penalty for convicted traffickers. However, Sir, in the war against drug traffickers, nothing, in my opinion, is too draconic. In addition to what we already have, I would like to recommend to the Minister to consider legislating the confiscation of profits arising from drug trafficking. We all know that the profits from drug trafficking are obscene. I read some place that a kilogram of heroin in the source country costing about $4,000-$5,000 can actually fetch up to $1 million in the street in the destination country. Sir, take away these profits and we remove the main reason for drug trafficking.

The death penalty, I agree, has been effective. But, Sir, it only normally hits the couriers. It does not touch the brains, the mastermind, behind the drug trafficking, because these are the people who actually plan the operation and you will never catch them in the streets. If their profits are confiscated, then we remove really one big source, in fact, the main reason for drug trafficking. In this respect, the confiscation of profits from the masterminds will surely complement the death penalty for the couriers. This is really nothing new. As a matter of fact, we have already before us a Bill of similar principle. I am referring to the Corruption (Confiscation of Benefits) Bill read for the First time in this Chamber on 15th March 1988. Sir, for conviction relating to the evasion of tax, the Comptroller of Inland Revenue, in fact,has the power to recover up to three times the amount of tax evaded. I would really like to ask the Minister that surely the war against drugs is just as serious as corruption and tax evasion, if not more. Would the Minster please consider this?

Prof. Jayakumar: Sir, first, the point raised by the Member for Clementi. I think he was away or abroad when certain information was made public by me. This concerns his request for progress on the implementation of the Intoxicating Substances Act and whether the situation has worsened or is under control or there has been some improvement. Recently, I did give some figures and, if I may avoid repeating all that I have said, the bottomline is we have seen in the few months subsequent to the implementation of the Act a reduction by at least a third of those detected and arrested for inhalant abuse. We have also seen the percentage of abusers arrested for below 20 years of age has come down. We hope that this trend will continue although it is too early to make a definitive assessment of the effects of the Act.

Secondly, may I touch on the point raised by the Member for Kaki Bukit. I believe the case he is referring to was also the subject of a letter in the Straits Times, am I right?

Mr Chew Heng Ching: Yes.

Prof. Jayakumar: If that is so, then I am familiar with the facts of the case. The point is that the person in question did not give his consent for voluntary treatment in the Falkland Centre. As the Member himself described, the scheme is that persons under 20 years of age can be admitted to the Centre even if they do not give consent. But persons who are adults will have to give consent; in other words, they are admitted for voluntary treatment. There are good reasons why we take that approach, which is unlike that of drugs. Members will recall that when I presented the Bill for adoption in this Chamber, I stressed that we had tailored that Bill deliberately taking into account one important factor - that the majority of inhalant abusers were in their teens and that the priority must be our attempts to get them off inhalant abuse. Because of that too, a less rigorous regime was adopted for treatment of inhalant abusers. Unlike drugs, where a first-time drug addict can be detained for treatment and rehabilitation in a DRC. For inhalant abusers, we have a different approach where a first-time abuser would be put under police supervision. In other words, he is put on notice and warning that he had better not repeat, otherwise he takes the risk of being admitted to Falkland Centre. It is only when a person is a repeater that he will be subject to treatment in a rehabilitation centre.

I take the point by the Member for Kaki Bukit that non-voluntary detention and treatment at the Centre should also apply to persons above the age of 21. This is a point which can be debated and it is a point which has to be given very serious consideration as to whether the limited resources we have in terms of counselling should be focussed on those who are in their teens, the very young, or should we also make them available to adults as well, knowing that the problem is a problem that acutely affects those who are under 20. We have also taken into account that inhalant abusers are different from drug addicts in that in drug addiction there is both psychological as well as physical dependence on the substance, whereas in the case of inhalant abuse, while there may be psychological dependence, you do not have the same physical dependence as in the case of drugs.

One might argue that adults should also be subject to compulsory treatment and rehabilitation. On the other side of the coin, the question can be posed whether adult inhalant abusers are in any way different, say, from an adult alcoholic. An adult alcoholic is not carted off to any centre for compulsory treatment. But, as I say, this is a point which can be debated. Our purpose and objective in introducing the Intoxicating Substances Bill was to get to the root of an urgent problem and to contain the real problem of very young people being affected by inhalant abuse. If the figures show that the problem is as bad for adults, perhaps we should have a look at it again. But in the meantime, I would prefer the present approach where adults can submit themselves to voluntary treatment and make best use of the facilities in the Falkland Centre. But the emphasis is on the word "voluntary", ie, they must consent. There are good reasons for that because members of the family may want a person to be admitted. But there are good legal safeguards which have to be observed by the persons administering the Act to ensure that there is no abuse and no forcible detention of a person merely because some members of the family want him to be dumped in a home.

A third point raised by the Member for Jalan Kayu. I take his point which is that if we want to have drug addicts who have kicked the habit to re-integrate in society, then they must be encouraged to take up employment. Not only must he be encouraged to take up employment, but employers - and the point he made is both in the public sector and private sector - ought not to hold against them the fact that they were drug addicts before. With that sentiment and approach, I am in full agreement because otherwise we have a vicious cycle. The problem is that we cannot force employers. We can only encourage and educate them. I would go along with his view, that is, that the Ministry of Home Affairs liaise with other government agencies to convey this point that they should not be inhibited in giving a drug addict, who has clearly kicked the habit, a chance to have a job. Sir, I have instructed the Central Narcotics Bureau, whenever it receives queries from government agencies, to indicate to them their assessment - has he given up the habit, is he still a drug addict or, in CNB's view, he has clearly kicked the habit? And this will be some guidance for the government agency. Of course, there may be some agencies where the work may involve sensitive, security-related considerations and the persons in-charge of hiring may have to be more careful than with other types of work. And I can tell him that I know of some departments in my own Ministry which have hired ex-drug addicts. So I agree with his sentiment and my Ministry will do its best to pass this message to other agencies.

Sir, there is one other question riased by the Member for Jalan Kayu, and that, is it concerns hisproposal for seizure of assets. My general approach to this is that, in our war against the drugs, anything which can be a further effective weapon ought to be considered. The asset seizure law, in principle, is something that we should seriously look at and I will ask my officials to get in touch with other countries which have adopted such legislation - and we understand that the United Kingdom in 1986 enacted such legisation; Malaysia has a draft Bill which is going through its final stages in Parliament, I believe - and to study the provisions and see whether we can adopt similar provisions for Singapore. But I would not want to rush into this because there are some complex legal problems involving the question of evidence, the rights and interests of other parties and the effective management of seized assets. I am told in some countries which have this law, they have big problems when suddenly they have to manage large supermarkets and other kinds of assets.

So we want not only to study the legal provisions but we also want to assess how other countries have implemented such legislation. Because, if we are to introduce such legislation, we must be convinced that it is workable and effective in its actual implementation. Subject to those considerations, I would like to assure him that we will study this very carefully.

Mr Tang See Chim (Chua Chu Kang): Sir, I shall be very brief but I would like your permission to speak on all the four items (e) to (g) inclusive, as they are inter-related.

The Chairman: Yes.

Mr Tang See Chim: Sir, Immigration has made significant contributions to the development of Singapore. According to the 1980 Census, out of a population of 2,413,945 persons enumerated in the census, 527,152 or 21.8% were born outside Singapore. That means these people were immigrants to Singapore and this has serious policy implications. It means that a lot of these people would have relatives outside, parents, sisters, brothers and possibly wives as well. All these people would then want to come to Singapore. And I think the Minister should have very compassionate policy to cover these applications.

Also, Mr Chairman, Sir, prior to Singapore's independence in 1965, people can move freely between Malaysia and Singapore. Then on the 31st August 1965 Independence came and some of these people were caught on the wrong side of the Causeway. These people because of the changed political situation found themselves without a permanent home. I think these people would really deserve the Minister's sympathetic consideration for their applications for permanent residence. And if for any reason permanent residence could not be granted, they should be granted long-term social visit passes and also they should be told that they would be entitled to it. I would also appeal to the Minister not to charge huge fees for these long-term social visit passes because some of these people really cannot afford such fees.

Another point I would like to bring up is that when work permit holders infringed immigration regulations, they were turned out of Singapore straightaway and more often than not would be banned permanently from entering Singapore. I think this is too severe a penalty to impose. Even criminals who were awarded life sentences do not get imprisonment for life. With good behaviour, I think the imprisonment is about 15 years. So I would seriously ask the Minister to be more compassionate in this regard.

The Chairman: I think I will take the suspension now.

Thereupon Mr Deputy Speaker left the Chair of the Committee and took the Chair of the House.

Mr Deputy Speaker: Order. I suspend the Sitting and will take the Chair again at 2 pm.

Sitting accordingly suspended at 1.00 pm until 2.00 pm. Sitting resumed at 2.00 pm

[Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair]

Debate in the Committee of Supply resumed.

[Mr Deputy Speaker in the Chair]

Head Q (cont.) -

Prof. Jayakumar: Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to reply to the points raised by the Member for Chua Chu Kang. First, may I say a few words about the general approach on immigration policy because the Member appealed for me to be compassionate. It is not that I have less compassion than other Members or less compassion than the Member for Chua Chu Kang. If you were to ask any Minister of any country who is in charge of immigration, whether a developed country or a developing country, I think he would give the answer that his country's immigration policy has to have a balance of both the search for talented and skilled persons as well as conferment of immigration benefits, entry and permanent residence, on the basis of connections with citizens and humanitarian or compassionate considerations for aged parents, children, wives and so on. So too for us. We have to be guided first by our overall national interests. And more so than other countries because of the limited size of our country, limited resources, our dense population. We also have to take into account that permanent residence brings with it certain consequences, privileges, concessions and benefits, in the area of housing, medical care, education, privileges which are paid for by the other citizens. So we have to have this uppermost in our minds. The ideal, of course, would be to let everyone in. That would be the most liberal and perhaps the most compassionate. But because of the considerations I have spelt out, we cannot. We have therefore to adopt a cautious, selective, even if it means a strict immigration policy.

Sir, as it is today, the size of what I would call our pool of potential applicants for permanent residence is quite large. And by the pool of potential permanent residents, I refer to those who applied for permanent residence (more than 14,000 last year); those who are on employment pass (more than 18,000); those who are on student pass (more than 37,000); those who are on social visit pass and keep on extending, (more than 150,000); and those who are on long-term social visit pass (more than 30,000). All these categories constitute potential permanent residents and it adds up to more than a quarter million, 254,172.

In addition to the figures that I have given, consider also the fact that the number of overstayers who were detected last year was 37,127. And those who were arrested for illegal overstaying, 3,532. The total of overstayers arrested and detected, 40,659. Last year, between 600 and 700 persons convicted for illegal overstaying were in jail.

I cite these figures just to give some idea of the overall nature of the potential and the fact that there are many people who really want to sink their roots here. If we could, we should let all of them in. But we cannot. And that is why the immigration policy must be based on what is in our national interest. This is translated into two questions, whether they have talents, whether they have skills, which would make them an asset for us in Singapore. That is one of the main considerations. But even if they did not, there is the other half of the coin where we take into account the considerations mentioned by the Member for Chua Chu Kang. So we consider other cases as well on grounds of connections with citizens, aged parents, wives and children. But here too, we have to be cautious and we have to ask ourselves whether they will be able to be cared for financially by their sponsors. Or in other words, they must not be a burden to the State.

Sir, now I turn to the specific questions posed by the Member. The first question he posed was with regard to those who were permanent residents and who had stayed here before separation and were caught by separation. I would like to give him the assurance that we have been quite liberal in this category. In other words, persons who were here and were permanent residents before immigration controls were established. Where such persons can satisfy us that they were resident and working in Singapore before separation and have continued to stay in Singapore and working in Singapore and have not lost their permanent residence, the immigration authorities will consider the case favourably and grant permanent residence. But we must be satisfied of the facts in each case. In other words, we must be satisfied that they indeed were here at the prescribed time and that they have continued to stay in Singapore and that they have not lost their permanent residence.

Secondly, the Member raised the question of wives of citizens. I have explained this on several occasions in the past. And for many years now, I think it has been made quite clear that marriage per se does not mean that there will be automatic right to indefinite stay or automatic permanent residence. The main approach taken here is whether the Singapore sponsor would be able to provide for the wife and children. That is the broadest consideration taken in approaching these cases.

We have looked at the experiences of other countries and the practices of other countries. And in most countries, marriage does not automatically confer permanent residence on the wives. If I may give an example, Sir. This is to cite the practice in the United Kingdom and I am reading from a 1987 booklet entitled "Immigration into Britain - Notes on the Regulations and Procedures". The section is entitled "Spouses". It is interesting that in the United Kingdom, marriage does not confer automatic entry, leave alone permanent residence. They have very stiff entry requirements in the first place. I quote:

'A man or woman may be admitted as a spouse of a person already settled in the United Kingdom. But to qualify for admission, the spouse must be 16 or over. An entry clearance officer will only grant entry clearance if he is satisfied that the marriage was not entered into primarily to obtain admission into the United Kingdom, that each of the parties has the intention of living permanently with the other as his or her spouse, that the parties to the marriage have met, that there will be adequate accommodation for the couple and their dependants without recourse to public funds in premises of their own or which they occupy themselves.'

And the couple will be able to maintain themselves and their dependants adequately without recourse to public funds. This is for entry clearance itself.

And what is meant by entry clearance? "An entry clearance is a visa, entry certificate or letter of consent issued to a passenger prior to travel to the United Kingdom." If you have one of these, you will not be refused permission to enter the United Kingdom unless there has been material change of circumstances. In other words, if you do not have any of these, you will not be allowed entry.

The Chairman: Order. Your time has expired.

Mr Tang See Chim: Sir, I just want to take up with the Minister on the regulations he read out from the booklet. Indeed, if all those conditions are met, the person will be given an entry clearance and then he will be able to enter the United Kingdom. Whereas in our case, for some foreign wives to enter Singapore is almost as difficult as the proverbial camel going through the needle's eye.

Prof. Jayakumar: That is not true, Sir. Except in one category, work permit marriage restriction cases where the person has contravened and is denied entry. In all other cases, wives are allowed to come to Singapore, are allowed to stay. The only question is whether they will be allowed indefinite stay or premanent residence. The United Kingdom may not even allow entry unless all these qualifications are met.

Mr Tang See Chim: Sir, the difference is that once they get the entry visa, they will be allowed permanent residence in the United Kingdom. Whereas here, we may allow them to enter for two weeks and after that we will turf them out.

Also, may I just take up this further point. If a work permit holder managed to get clearance from the Commissioner for Employment to marry a Singapore citizen, that marriage itself does not guarantee permanent residence in Singapore. I think this gives a bit of confusion among the people; because they say, "Both departments are government departments and if one department allows me to marry after application, I should be allowed to stay." I suggest the Minister together with the Minister for Labour who looks after the Commissioner for Employment's Office, come to some sort of understanding so that confusion will not be created in the minds of the people.

Prof. Jayakumar: Sir, since I note the Member for Toa Payoh also has a question concerning work permit marriage restrictions, perhaps a fuller answer can be given to the Member for Chua Chu Kang when the Member for Toa Payoh raises it later on.

Mr Bernard Chen: Sir, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Dr Ho Tat Kin (Boon Teck): Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QC 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, when the Neighbourhood Police Post, or NPP, as we call it now, was started, the Japanese consultants recommend that a Police officer should be standing in front of the post to watch the people and what is going on. In Japan this is a very prominent feature of the koban system. But this practice is not followed in Singapore. I believe a police officer standing in front of the police post has more significance than just watching people and see what is going on. He is a front line crime preventer. To the residents, a police officer standing in front of a post reminds them that the Police is on the scene. It gives the residents a greater sense of security. It is also easier for a police officer to reach out to the residents, make friends and maintain a closer friendly working relationship with the residents.

I think the NPP should not just remove this feature of the koban system just to reduce manpower. I hope the Minister can review this aspect of NPP work.

When NPP was started, police patrolling of blocks was very common. Residents get to know the Police officers in charge of the block and the Police officers get to know the residents well. This is a very good feature of the NPP work. But recently residents started complaining. They no longer see Police patrolling the blocks anymore. They have also noticed a reduction in NPP manpower. Sir, in my constituency, the NPP started with 28 officers. Today we can only count 16 of them. The number of officers at the counter on a shift has also been reduced from two men to one man. Now one OC has to be shared between two posts. Sir, I understand the staffing of NPP was based on a management consultant's report and this management consultant has worked out the manpower requirement based on the number of police reports received per day. It seems that on the average the NPP receive only three to four reports a day, or one report on an 8-hour shift. So to reduce wastage in manpower, the consultant recommend a reduction in manpower. I think the role of Police officers is not just to receive reports. They are there to prevent crime. The fact that so few Police reports were received could mean that NPP has been successful in reducing crime. So reducing the manpower at the post may not be a correct move.

I understand at present a team at the NPP consists of only four officers. If one officer takes sick leave, at the same time another is away on annual leave, there will be only two left. At night there is only one officer at the counter on duty. However, when in an emergency such as a robbery, the single officer on duty is alerted he cannot leave his post. He has to call the police station to inform his OC that he is responding. Then he has to lock up the post before he can leave to deal with the robbery.

Sir, lately crime prevention work has also been passed on to the NPP, thus increasing their work load. I would like to seek the Minister's assurance that the reduction in NPP manpower coupled with the increased responsibility of the NPP will not lead to increased crime rates. I would also like to suggest to the Minister to consider using police volunteers to supplement NPP manpower. I am thinking of a different form of volunteers, volunteers who live within the constituency themselves and they can be recruited and trained inside the constituency. Sir, these volunteers can then supplement NPP manpower, particularly after normal office hours. Being residents in the same constituency, it will be easier for them to gather information on crime activities. It will also allow residents to play a more active role in crime prevention.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, the points that I wish to raise have already been covered by the Member for Boon Teck. But I have just one little point, and that is, to reinforce his argument that there is a reduction in manpower in the NPP. Originally it was eight per shift, now it has been reduced to four.

Mr Chng Hee Kok (Radin Mas): Sir, our road building programme, as we have been informed by the Minister for National Development, is coming to an end. Most of the major expressways, except for the Central Expressway, are already in place. I will like to raise two issues with the Minister today. The first is on the discipline of drivers on the expressways and the second matter is on speed limit.

Sir, there are many cases of poor driving skills and bad behaviour on our expressways. I can name three instances. We have heavy vehicles in which refuse to take the left lane. The driver hogs the middle or the right lane and occasionally you see two heavy vehicles, one trying to overtake the other at 50 kph. Another instance of road hogging comes from those who drive slowly, way below the speed limit of 80 kph on the overtaking or the outermost lane. This is extremely frustrating for many other drivers. They also pose a hazard to other drivers as well. The last instance is this. There is very little preparation of some drivers when they approach the slip roads. In many instances you see such drivers taking the outermost lane and 200 metres before the exit to the slip road, will try to filter to the left. Just a couple of weeks ago, I witnessed personally a near collision on one of these expressways. A number of cars came to a screeching halt in the middle lane and all because the driver of the front car was trying to take off at the exit point about 50 metres away. But because there were a number of cars going on the left lane he was unable to filter out. He stopped his car right in the middle of the road and waited for the cars on the left to pass. This is extremely hazardous and I think a number of accidents are caused by poor drivers of this kind.

Sir, the expressways are meant to improve our road communication system. Now that they are all in place, I think we should and must do something to improve the driving skills and driving habits of users of the expressways. We can improve the education process through television and through talks at the community centres. Perhaps a focus on this issue when the learner drivers take their tests will help. Of course,there are many other ways and I leave it to the Minister to look into this.

However, to go only for education will not really solve the problem, in my opinion. This must be coupled with more effective enforcement measures. I do not know whether the existing legislation is adequate. But certainly the Traffic Police at the moment is focusing too much on speeding rather than poor driving habits.

Sir, let me now talk about the overtaking lane and the speed limit. At the present moment most of our expressways have a speed limit of 80 kph. While driving, I like to work in the old system. The old system says only 50 mph. 50 mph is actually very slow on our roads. You will find that it is very difficult to drive below 80 kph on a four or three lane expressway. In many countries, like in Europe, the speed limit is 70 mph or about 120 kph. I suggest that for the overtaking lane, the fastest lane on the road, the speed limit should be increased to 100 kph. Sir, for this particular lane, we should perhaps look into imposing a minimum speed limit. This is to make sure that road hogs, people who drive slowly, do not drive on the wrong lane. By doing so I think this will improve our communications, make it more efficient for all drivers. I urge the Minister to take a serious look at altering the speed limit, Sir.

Prof. Jayakumar: Let me answer the points raised by the Member for Boon Teck and the Member for Toa Payoh and my colleague, the Minister of State, will answer the points raised by the Member for Radin Mas.

Regarding the concern expressed by the Members for Boon Teck and Toa Payoh about staffing levels in the NPP, I find it interesting that they are both from constituencies which were involved in the first phase of establishment of NPPs when we were, I would say, trying things out before we settled on the optimum manning levels, procedures and work system for NPP. It is true that staffing levels have been reduced not only because of the recent study by the consultants but, even before the manpower consultants were brought in, the Police themselves had made a study and concluded that each NPP could be staffed by 20 junior officers. This was later re-examined and endorsed by the consultants. In addition to the complement of 20 junior officers, there will be six national servicemen to supplement the regulars for purposes of crowd control and patrolling duties.

I want to dispel any confusion or any notion that all the NPPs had, say, 30, 35 or 40 staff complement and suddenly everything has been reduced. This is not so. I have looked at the figures. As of now there are about 62 NPPs which have been established in a period since 1983 in five different phases. Of the 62 NPPs, only 13 had an initial staffing of more than 24. Whilst the majority of the NPP started right from the beginning with a complement of 20 or less, it was those in the first phase, Kim Keat, Toa Payoh, Boon Teck, Kuo Chuan, Khe Bong, Aljunied, which had a staffing of 28, 30, 34. Those were the early years. As I said, the Police themselves made a detailed study and concluded that the optimum level can be 20 supplemented by six regular national servicemen.

I also want to assure the Member for Boon Teck that it is not solely on the basis of the number of reports which are received. I have sat down with the Commissioner of Police and others who are involved in the implementation of NPP as well as with the consultants, and I am satisfied that their basis for computing the proper manning levels was arrivedby a fairly detailed examination of the workload of every officer in the NPP. It is a very detailed study of time management, workload, duties of the officers, including at the NPP as well as outside the NPP. I take his point that there is some usefulness of the Police officer standing in front of the NPP but this is debatable and I would leave it to the professional judgment of the Commissioner of Police. It is very unlikely that the non-law abiding persons are going to frequent the vicinity of the NPP. It is the law-abiding persons who are more likely going to be around the NPP area. If the Police in their professional judgment conclude that that person, who would otherwise be standing in front of the NPP, can be better utilized for other NPP duties such as patrolling, house visits, I think I would defer to their judgment. But the important point that should be stressed is that, in working out the proper manning levels, we have had the uppermost consideration that the NPP must be able to serve the residents and discharge the functions for which they were originally conceived of and introduced.

Now let me turn to his other point of volunteers being brought in to help the NPP. This is a point which my Ministry has over the last year been considering and we have had discussions with the Police as well as the VSC (Volunteer Special Constabulary). Here, I ought to pay tribute to the work done by the Volunteer Special Constabulary because they comprise persons from all walks of life - professionals, doctors, lawyers, secretaries, to clerks - and they take time off to participate in performing police duties. I think they have done a marvellous job, and we have discussed with them and they are very enthusiastic in considering what other ways they can be of assistance.

I am glad to say that to enhance the security, in addition to what they are doing, the VSC will be launching on a pilot basis a patrol scheme in two constituencies which precise venues will be decided soon. This experimental pilot scheme will be launched within the next few months. The idea is that it will enhance Police presence. It will augment the NPP role and hopefully to arouse greater interest in community-oriented policing and in the VSC itself.

The Member for Boon Teck asked: if the residents in the constituency are interested in such volunteer work, what would be our response? I would say that if any Member tells me that there are residents in his constituency who would want to volunteer and join the VSC for the purposes of such constituency patrols, I am sure the VSC will welcome this with open arms. There are certain qualifications to be met and, of course, there must be the usual security screening to ensure that the wrong type of persons do not get into these patrols. Yes, the idea has been thought of. It will be introduced on a pilot basis. Whether it can be extended further to more constituencies will depend precisely on whether there will be residents forthcoming for this purpose.

Dr Lee Boon Yang: Sir, the Member for Radin Mas spoke about the lack of discipline amongst some drivers on our expressways. He quoted a number of examples of such drivers, for instance, drivers who travel at low speed in the outermost right lane or drivers who turn from the wrong lane. Our expressways are designed for relatively fast and continuous flow of traffic. It is true that some drivers have not quite adjusted to driving on our expressways. It is also true that some slow drivers continue to hog the right lane meant for overtaking vehicles. I agree with the Member for Radin Mas that road-hogging is a hazard to other road users and the person who holds up traffic by hogging the right lane forces other vehicles to overtake on the left lane. That is a dangerous thing to do on the expressway and the road-hogger can unwittingly cause an accident to happen. Since vehicles are travelling at very high speeds on expressways, such accidents can have disastrous consequences.

Over the past few years, the Traffic Police has put in a great deal of effort to educate the public through the mass media on expressway driving. Publications on the correct use of expressways were distributed to the motoring public and, of course, Members will recall that we had changed the system of driver's training in order to produce a better quality driver. Today the system of driver's training involves a more intensive two-stage theory of driving and also practical training on the circuit before such drivers are allowed on the road.

Another measure which has been taken to try to improve the standard of driving on our expressways is the formation of the Expressway Patrol Unit in 1985. This Expressway Patrol Unit (EPU) consisted of eight high-performance cars which were deployed on the Pan-Island Expressway and with their deployment improvements were noticed in the general driving behaviour of motorists along the expressway. In fact, serious accidents on the Pan-island Expressway, patrolled by the EPU, were reduced by 41%. The Traffic Police has plans to have a full complement of 20 cars by the end of this year so that our entire system of expressways can be patrolled by the Expressway Patrol Unit.

For this year, Sir, the Traffic Police will launch a public education programme through extensive media publicity on the dangers of road-hogging. At the same time, patrols on the expressways will be stepped up to educate the public on the proper use of expressways and the Traffic Police will certainly be on the look-out for road-hoggers.

The Member made a suggestion about reserving the use of the right lane for overtaking vehicles. I will certainly give his suggestion further consideration and see if it can be applied here.

The Member also wanted the Traffic Police to look into the speed limit on expressways. Am I correct?

Mr Chng Hee Kok: Yes.

Dr Lee Boon Yang: Sir, our expressways are not quite similar to expressways in other countries. Expressways in other countries are meant for long-distance inter-city travel where you have long stretches of open road with very little intersections. Our expressways in Singapore are relatively short and there are many exits or entry points closely spaced together. Our expressways generally have a speed limit of 80 kph, but right now there are still two stretches of expressway which have a speed limit of 70 kph. I notice the Member for Radin Mas say that it is very difficult to travel on expressways below 80 kph. But these two stretches of our expressway, ie, the part of the Pan-Island Expressway between Jalan Eunos and the interchange at Mount Pleasant and the Keppel viaduct which is part of the Ayer Rajah Expressway, carry a very high traffic volume. This is one of the reasons why the speed limit at these two sections had to be kept lower than the other parts of the expressway network.

Sir, a car travelling at 80 kph will require about 25% more stopping distance compared to a car that is travelling at 70 kph. Therefore, raising the speed limit along the stretches of expressway which are already congested and already carrying very heavy traffic volume would not be in the interest of road safety.

The Chairman: Order. The time allotted for this amendment has expired. Dr Ho, can you withdraw your amendment?

Mr Heng Chiang Meng: Sir, I do not have a reply on the NPP.

The Chairman: Mr Heng, I have just said that the time allotted for this amendment has expired. Dr Ho.

Dr Ho Tat Kin: Sir, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The Chairman: Amendment No. (3) - 15 minutes. Mr Eric Cheong.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QD 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, may I cover my other amendment as well? It is related.

The Chairman: Yes.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, I would like to ask the Minister whether the Singapore Civil Defence Force (SCDF) has a well-structured training programme for its reservists, including those transferred from the Singapore Armed Forces. As you are aware, some of these reservists were transferred to the Civil Defence for quite some time.

The next question I would like to ask is, what is the progress of the plans for the construction of shelters in Housing Board estates under the National Shelter policy announced by the Government in October 1986, and will HDB shelters be put to peace-time uses and what kind of uses will be allowed. Also, are there any plans for emergency shelters, like protective walls, in HDB void decks in times of emergency? I do not know whether the Minister is aware that during the Second World War, the old SIT flats in Tiong Bahru had protective walls constructed along the passageway to give adequate protection in case of air-raids. May I know from the Minister whether there are such plans to be made or does the Ministry also encourage private property owners to do likewise in private housing estates.

Encik Abbas Abu Amin (Pasir Panjang): Sir, I know that several improvements and changes have been made to the training programme and the training syllabus for training of full-time Construction Brigade national servicemen. I would like to know from the Minister whether further progress has been made to ensure that the discipline, work attitude and the skills training of these young trainees are being enhanced. What is the general attitude and response of the contractors, sub-contractors and supervisors who handle these young national servicemen at the worksite? I believe, Sir, the contractors, sub-contractors and supervisors can do a lot more to motivate our young national servicemen in their work attitude.

Finally, Sir, can we have more publicity to inform the parents and the general public of the good work done by these trainees and their contributions as part of the Civil Defence Force and also a component of the Total Defence Force?

Dr Lee Boon Yang: Sir, the Member for Toa Payoh asked whether the Singapore Civil Defence Force has a well-structured training programme for its reservists. In any organization which aspires to be effective, training is essential and the Singapore Civil Defence Force which was formed in 1982 is no different from any other organization. Charged with the task of providing the mainstay of our nation's civil defence capability, the Force has a small core of regular officers and staff. They set directions and support a pool of full-time national servicemen serving in the Construction Brigade and an even larger component of the Civil Defence Reservist Unit and also constituency-based civil defence volunteer units. Together, they will be responsible for performing rescue operations, managing and operating civil defence facilities, such as shelters, and organizing the population to cope with emergencies when the need arises. Training and exercises are therefore given high priority within the Singapore Civil Defence Force.

Sir, the roles and functions of the Civil Defence personnel are diverse, ranging from simple first-aid skills to complex tasks such as organizing the population for evacuation to shelters and conducting massive rescue operations using a wide variety of equipment. To meet such diverse requirement, training of a wide variety of skills is needed. Faced with these complex and variety of tasks for its functional units, the Civil Defence Force has drawn up appropriate training programmes to ensure that each unit is trained and capable of carrying out its designated role. These training programmes are specially tailored according to the unit's tasks.

Sir, the training provided to CD's reservists covers individual skills such as first-aid, fire fighting, basic rescue and evacuation, and vocational skills such as radio communication, heavy plant operation, driving, vehicle and equipment maintenance and so on. Reservists with leadership qualities are given command responsibilities. They are then provided with additional training to fulfil their roles as leaders. They are taught subjects such as operation procedures, man- management skill, civil defence system and equipment.

Sir, the reservists, apart from their individual and vocational training, are also trained to operate in groups or units to undertake specific missions. This training is conducted in the form of exercises and proficiency tests. And subsequent in-camp training will refresh the reservists in their skills not only at the individual but also at the group or unit level, helping to maintain overall operational readiness and the ability to respond to emergency.

Some of the reservist units have also taken part in public exercises conducted in constituencies such as community spirit exercises and emergency exercises such as food distribution, water and blood collections during their in-camp training. The training period for a CD unit will vary depending on the type of tasks that they are charged with. For example, rescue battalions are expected to undertake complex and long duration rescue operation. These men undergo in-camp training of up to 18 days. Subsequently, this period of in-camp training is reduced to six days as they get more experience. Zone units which are required to perform basic functions such as rendering first-aid, evacuation and simple rescue undergo up to nine days of in-camp training. And when they have more experience, the unit's ability improves, then the in-camp training is reduced to two days. And there is, of course, the annual in-camp periods which are kept at a minimum to ensure that each unit is capable of performing its given role at any time when needed.

Sir, with this positive support from our reservists, we are confident that we will be able to build up a credible Civil Defence capability for our nation. The SCDF will continue to build up its level of expertise and widen its pool of trained CD personnel through a well-structured and dedicated training programme.

Sir, the Member for Toa Payoh also asked about the progress of construction of shelters in the HDB estates and also how will these shelters be put to peacetime uses.

In October 1986 it was announced that future HDB development will incorporate construction of shelters. Stage one of this programme will last five years to cover HDB's sixth housing programme. Sir, these shelters will not only provide protection for the civilian population in an emergency, but will have to be put to good use during peacetime. The construction of the shelters in HDB estates has commenced. The first eight HDB apartment blocks with shelters are expected to be ready by the end of this year. These are located in Pasir Ris and Jurong West estates. By 1993 it is anticipated that a total of about 829 blocks with shelters would have been built. This forms the scope of the first phase of shelter construction. It is a pilot project which can yield vital information for expanding our emergency shelter programme in the future.

Peacetime uses for these shelters. I think this is a very important aspect of our emergency shelter programme. The shelters would have to be put to good use during peace time. This will ensure that shelter space is well used and properly maintained. There are proposals to use HDB shelters as RC centres, child-care centres, library, study rooms and space for social and recreational activities by the residents in the neighbourhood. Sir, my Ministry, the Ministry of Community Development, People's Association and HDB are presently looking into the possible uses of shelters under peacetime. Community leaders will, of course, be consulted.

Since this is the first time that Government has embarked on such a programme, there is a need to assess the result of the first phase of shelter construction. My Ministry, together with HDB and the Ministry of Community Development, will carefully assess the cost, maintenance and the results of peacetime uses of shelters built in the first phase. We will be guided by the results of this pilot project in seeking to implement a wider emergency shelter programme.

Now, the final point raised by the Member for Toa Payoh about providing protective walls on HDB void decks. This could be considered by the people who are planning these shelters because the idea is to provide shelters in the HDB blocks which will accommodate the people. If over and above these shelters you still need to provide other protective measures, these can be considered.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: The Minister of State has not answered the point about the private sector involvement, for instance, condominiums. Will they be drawn into this plan?

Dr Lee Boon Yang: As I said, Sir, we have just started on this emergency shelter programme. We need to assess the progress of this first phase, particularly how these shelters can be used in peacetime. After having gained experience, we will then be able to guide the private sector in the constructon of shelters in their own development.

Sir, the Member for Pasir Panjang asked for a progress report on the Construction Brigade. He would like to know whether discipline has improved, in terms of absentism, and work attitude among the Construction Brigade members.

Sir, the Construction Brigade is a part of the Singapore Civil Defence Force. It was introduced in December 1981 with the primary objective of building up a pool of NS men who are trained in various construction skills so that they can meet our civil defence needs in an emergency. The scheme was revised in December 1985 to improve the standards of discipline and trade training for the Construction Brigade members. With the revision, discipline of the NS men in the Construction Brigade has improved. The absenteeism rate in worksite has dropped significantly from 30.4% under the old scheme to 14.2% under the new revised scheme. A comprehensive skills training programme is also available under the revised scheme. It allows every NS man to attain a level of skill according to his ability and motivation. In addition, promising NS men are trained to multi-skill, in other words they will learn not just a single skill but also other skills in the construction trade. This is an opportunity which was previously available only to trainees on the open market, that is, people who enrolled at the Construction Industry Training Centre to improve their skills and career prospects.

Sir, on average, 23% of the national servicemen enlisted under the revised scheme will be trained up to this multi-skill level, which means that under the revised scheme we are producing Construction Brigade men who are as well trained as other CITC graduates and who should be able to command equal salary on their release from national service.

Sir, we conducted a survey in March 1987 on a sample of 60 contractors who were employing NS men from the Construction Brigade. 85% of them noticed improvement in work attitude among the NS men, 91% also reported improvement in skills under the revised scheme. I believe the Construction Brigade has been able to overcome previous problems and it is well on its way to producing NS men with a high level of construction skills which will not only be useful for our Civil Defence effort, but will also provide these men with the means of earning a livelihood when they finished their national service.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, in view of the Minister of State's reply, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The Chairman: Amendment No. (4). 16 minutes.

Mr Bernard Chen: Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QE 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, I would like to just touch on the subject of fire regulations. As members of the GPC (Home Affairs), we received quite a number of representations on difficulties encountered by developers of commercial properties in complying with fire regulations. We had a series of briefings from the Ministry in which we were told that all the regulations were, in fact, in order and there was nothing to worry about. We are thus in a kind of quandary as to determine who is right and who is wrong. The problem of compliance with fire regulations is a costly one. For example, if a design has to be changed to comply with some fire regulations, it may mean a change in some of the basic infrastructure, for example, fire sprinkler system which can cost up to millions of dollars. It may require construction of fire walls. It may even involve construction of extra staircases. Sometimes the revision of the design in order that it complies with the regulations can result in a complete change of the design, causing very long delays for the developer.

We have looked at the problem in some detail and our view is that it may well be the problem of interpretation of these regulations rather than the regulations themselves. When these regulations are promulgated, they look innocuous. People think that they can comply, but when it comes to interpretation by the fire officers in the Fire Safety Bureau, that is where the difference of opinion arises. If I may suggest, the safest course for the fire officers in the Bureau is to stick strictly to the letter of these regulations, allowing for no variations.

On the other hand, each individual case put forward by commercial developers may have to be examined on its own merits and that some flexibility can be allowed. The to-ing and fro-ing of discussions between developers and the fire officers as to how best to comply with the regulations have to my knowledge caused a lot of heartaches, a lot of pains and also a lot of costs. I was wondering whether the Ministry could consider a way in which this bargaining and this interpretation can be reduced to the minimum, and whether, in fact, the Ministry has provided a recourse for appeal for developers who genuinely feel that they have a good case to ask for flexibility in the interpretation of these regulations. Because if the fire officers in the Fire Safety Bureau insist that the regulations are complied to the letter, then the end-result would be a delay of projects. Proverbially, the best thing to do is to have a set of regulations that will ensure no fire, that means - have no buildings, therefore, there will be no fire. I do not think that is really what we want, neither do I think that is what the Ministry wants.

I hope the Ministry can see a way of getting this passed through and perhaps extend to the officers of the Fire Safety Bureau a certain degree of flexibility. As in the case of the Building Control Department in the Ministry of National Develop- ment, depending on circumstances of the case, certain exceptions and certain flexibility are allowed so that the projects can go ahead at least cost to the developers. But at the same time this ensures that, at least, the maximum possible fire safety regulations can be complied with.

Mr Teo Chong Tee: Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir, Singapore's skyline has changed. With many high-rise buildings now in Singapore, some rising to more than 50 storeys high, like hotels, commercial buildings, private and public dwelling apartments, fire fighting has become more complicated for the Fire Service Department if a fire were to break out in any of the high-rise buildings.

Sir, surely we do not want to see a towering inferno in Singapore. In the past, fires which destroyed kampong houses were rampant. Fire fighting at that time was not so complicated because the buildings were low-rise. But now the demand for fire fighting service calls for the provision of a more sophisticated type of training and equipment. I would like to request the Hon. Minister to enlighten us on the type of skills training that the Fire Service Department has been conducting for its fire service personnel and the type of fire fighting equipment acquired to fight high-rise fires as well as to save lives. I would also like to find out from the Minister whether our Fire Service personnel are being sent overseas for training.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir, as we all know, ambulance services are run by the Singapore Fire Service and also by the Government hospitals. As there is an increasing need for the sick and aged to be transported from place to place, many of these cases are non-emergency cases requiring an ambulance run by the Fire Service. I think this will impose a tremendous strain on the services of the Fire Service if non-emergency cases are often used at the expense of real emergency cases where serious accidents or calamities are involved. I would like to ask the Minister whether he will consider allowing ambulances to be run by private entrepreneurs who will provide this type of service for those who need ambulance services for the sick, the aged and any other non-emergency cases.

Dr Lee Boon Yang: Sir, the Member for Clementi who is also the Chairman of the GPC for Home Affairs asked for a more flexible implementation of regulations to ensure the fire safety of buildings in Singapore. The Fire Safety Bureau (FSB) of my Ministry vets building plans to ensure that appropriate standards of fire safety are maintained. Where the safety of large numbers of people as in a high-rise building is concerned, these standards cannot be compromised. This is not to say that there is no room for flexibility at all. But flexibility has its limits. If rules are set aside for purely commercial reasons, then you will see buildings being put up which may become future causes of unnecessary tragedy. The paramount overriding interest for having these standards and a strict implementation is that of public interest, namely, to avoid loss of lives, injuries and damage to properties.

Sir, what are the potential causes of disregarding the minimum standards of fire safety? 1st February 1974, Sao Paulo, Brazil. 179 people died in a fire which engulfed the Joma Building which is a 25-storey reinforced concrete structure, only two years old. The fire started at about 8.40 am in the morning and within an hour, spread and gutted the entire upper part of the building except for the first six storeys which was a car park.

Then again on 31st December 1986, 96 people died, 140 were injured in a fire which razed the Dupont Plaza Hotel and Casino in Puerto Rico. More recently, Sir, 1st January 1988, 13 people including 7 Singaporeans died and 25 people were injured when a pre-dawn blaze swept through the First Hotel in Bangkok.

Sir, in these three examples which I have just cited, there were many shortcomings in the buildings which caught fire. They did not have automatic sprinkler systems. Some of the buildings did not even have automatic fire detection or alarm systems. Escape routes, fire escapes, from these buildings were not adequately protected with fire safe partitions and doors. Fire escapes were inadequate to cope with the occupant-loads in some cases. In some cases, the building design allowed smoke to spread rapidly throughout the entire structure, hindering escape and also causing many unnecessary deaths by asphyxiation.

Sir, I have taken up precious minutes to highlight these examples to show what can go wrong when buildings are put up with scant attention to basic rules of fire safety. And, secondly, to explain why our Fire Service and our Fire Safety Bureau must be vigilant in carrying out its task of ensuring that our buildings are made as safe and as technically and economically feasible.

Sir, the building plan vetting system in the Fire Safety Bureau is far from being a bureaucratic machine. The Member for Clementi has asked whether the Ministry has provided opportunities for appeal. The FSB has built-in flexibility and opportunities for exercising human judgment. Let me give you some examples of this flexibility.

(a) Architects and engineers may propose alternatives to the guidelines suggested in the fire code to satisfy the intended fire safety requirements. Very often, the Fire Safety Bureau officers themselves will suggest alternatives when professionals encounter difficulty in meeting the safety standards of the fire code.

(b) Architects and engineers may approach the Fire Safety Bureau officers at all levels for discussion if they are in doubt of any requirements imposed on their plans.

(c) There is an existing waiver committee to consider all appeals against decisions not acceptable to the profession. Sir, decisions are not made by just one official going strictly according to the rules. There are many opportunities for consultation and discussion.

(d) The Fire Safety Bureau holds regular dialogue sessions with professionals to discuss problematical procedures and technical issues.

(e) The Fire Safety Bureau has formalized a standing committee which has representatives from the professional bodies including the Singapore Institute of Architects, Institute of Engineers Singa- pore, Real Estate Developers' Association of Singapore, Association of Consulting Engineers Singapore and Institution of Fire Engineers. The standing committee provides a forum for professionals to bring up their suggestions and feedback for consideration by the Fire Safety Bureau.

Sir, the Fire Safety Bureau is therefore very accessible to professionals and consultative in its approach. Architects and engineers must play their part by submitting good quality plans and assuming professional responsibility in the work that they undertake. The FSB is there to check the professionals' proposal to ensure that this satisfied minimum standards required under the fire code. Nevertheless, Sir, in the interest of public safety, the FSB has also been providing consultative advice by suggesting to professionals alternative ways to meet the safety standards required under the fire code.

Sir, occasionally, this state of affairs is taken for granted and when the professionals fail to understand the rationale for a particular safety requirement, the Fire Safety Bureau is then accused of being inflexible.

In conclusion, I would like to say that it is important that professionals take fire safety seriously. The potential danger of a disaster is always there. The Fire Safety Bureau is always open-minded to proposals put up by professionals. In the final analysis, both the Fire Safety Bureau and the professionals should act together on the basis that safety of members of the public must always come first.

Sir, I would now like to turn to the Member for Changi who asked what sort of training do firemen receive to enable them to cope with high-rise fires, and what kind of equipment is available to the Fire Service for fighting such high-rise fires. To begin with, a properly designed and built building, as we have just discussed a moment ago, should incorporate fire safety features as a first line of defence against potential fire hazards. Therefore, high-rise buildings such as commercial complexes and hotels are required under the present fire code to install automatic sprinkler systems, smoke or heat detector systems, built-in fire water mains and hydrant systems and a proper means of escape with fire protected staircase. Our high-rise buildings are also designed to prevent the spread of fires and to confine any fire outbreak to the floor of origin.

In the event of a fire breaking out, the Singapore Fire Service stands ready to go into action to rescue people and to put out the fire. The Singapore Fire Service has a 150-strong special search and rescue squad whose members are specially trained to undertake rescue operations in high-rise buildings on fire. This squad has also been trained on aerial evacuation techniques using helicopters. Regular weekly exercises are carried out by this squad in high-rise buildings to practise their skills.

Sir, for fighting high-rise fires, all the 27 fire engines acquired by the Singapore Fire Service since 1976 have been fitted with larger capacity pumps to reach to a greater height.

The Chairman: Order. The time for the debate has expired. Mr Chen, would you like to withdraw your amendment?

Dr Lee Boon Yang: Sir, just one moment. Regarding the Member for Toa Payoh's suggestion on privatization of the ambulance service, I will take up his suggestion and I encourage it, in fact.

Mr Bernard Chen: Sir, can I be allowed two minutes just to make one point?

The Chairman; No. We have exceeded the time already. Sorry.

Mr Bernard Chen: We still have lots of time. The guillotine is at 3.50 pm.

The Chairman: No. We still have a lot of other Members who wish to speak and a lot of other topics to cover.

Mr Bernard Chen: All right. I withdraw the amendment under protest.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

The Chairman: Amendment No. 5, 20 minutes only. Encik Ibrahim.

Encik Ibrahim Othman (Tanah Merah): Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QG 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, in moving this amendment, I wish to ask the Minister for Home Affairs for the number of relapse cases of addicts who have been released from the DRCs. Out of the total number in the DRCs now, how many are there for the second time or more? What is the percentage when compared to the total number of the addicts in the DRCs?

Sir, there are many reasons why these addicts return to drugs after their release. May I know whether the Ministry of Home Affairs has done any studies to find out the reasons why these addicts continue their drug taking habits again. At this juncture, perhaps the Minister could elaborate on the kind of activities or programmes being implemented in the DRCs? Are the programmes or the kinds of activities in the DRC suitable and relevant to the needs of the inmates? I am told that some of these addicts who have been released from the DRC would not mind returning to that place because for them life is better in the DRC than outside. I think some of them have difficulty in adjusting their lives back in society. Many of them face problems, among them the inability to get employment resulting in financial difficulties and their inability to support their families. In many instances, their relationship with other members of their families becomes strained. So instead of being happy after being released from the DRC, they feel very frustrated and therefore resort to drug taking again.

Perhaps we could consider taking tougher measures by having tougher programmes for these inmates in the DRC so that they would not want to go back or find themselves back in the DRC again.

I also wish to ask the Minister whether we have special schemes, like the the pre-release employment (that the Minister explained this morning) for these inmates at the DRC. If we have this kind of a scheme, perhaps we could allow them to go to work, say, six months before their release. And once they are financially stable, we can release them and they can go back to their families again.

Encik Abbas Abu Amin: Sir, are the existing enforcement actions adequate to cope with the drug problem that we have in Singapore? In view of the recent development in the tactics and techniques used by drug takers and ant traffickers to bring in supplies from outside Singapore, could additional measures be introduced to tighten further the control and restrict the movement of our youths to go in and out of the causeway. I feel that the fight against drug taking and drug trafficking must be intensified.

Sir, I agree with the comment made by my colleague, the Member for Tanah Merah, that there is a general feeling that the drug addicts have too good a life in the DRCs. For example, they have better and regular meals than they used to have at home. My question is, whether the rehabilitation programme and the activities carried out in the DRCs could be made tough enough to deter or discourage the drug addicts to be in the DRCs for a second time.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, my other colleagues have a wide range of subjects on the drug control. I have just one point to make, and that is, whether the Minister will consider the confiscation of vehicles used in the transportation of illegal drugs. This is different from confiscation of assets that may belong to the drug traffickers. But these vehicles may belong to somebody else. So probably we should have some appropriate legislation to confiscate their vehicles so as to discourage drug traffickers.

Prof. Jayakumar: Sir, first, can I take up the point made by the Member for Tanah Merah concerning the rehabilitation system and the relapse rate. As for the specific figures which he asked for, I am afraid I do not have them with me now but if he were to file a question for oral or written answer, I will be happy to supply him. But I can give him a broad picture.

While we have contained the drug problem over the years and we have smashed the big-time drug trafficking, there are really two residual problems which we have now. First, ant trafficking, which has been widely publicised. These are People bringing in small amounts of drugs, not large quantities as to attract the very severe penalties, such as the death penalty. We have also brought the infection rate down. In 1977, out of three persons arrested, two were new addicts. Now, out of four arrested, one would be a new addict. The second problem is that of relapse rate. We have been fortunate in bringing down the number of first timers. For example, in 1980, about 42% of those arrested were first timers. We brought this down to less than 40% during the years 1981 to 1984. From 1985 to 1987 we brought it down to less than 30%. But as we bring down the number of first timers, the looming and cumulative problem is that of the hardcore addicts or the repeaters, and close to 75% are repeaters. This means that we have had to take a very hard look at our rehabilitation system and to make it even more effective. For this purpose, we established a working group last year comprising Home Affairs representatives, lecturers from the NUS, social workers, doctors, psychiatrists and others. They examine our DRCs and rehabilitation system and make several recommendations. The objective of the recommendations which are now being implemented is to make significant changes to the rehabilitation system on both the philosophy of rehabilitation as well as the regime of treatment of the addicts.

As regards philosophy, hitherto the addicts have been by and large treated as patients and all of them are put through the same mass rehabilitation scheme, with little allowance for individual approach and not distinguishing those who are more amenable, more susceptible, to rehabilitation from those who may be less responsive.

As regards the philosophy and attitude, the change is to treat addiction as a social and behaviourial problem. In other words, the addict must himself be responsible for his own actions and he must desire to change if the rehabilitation is to succeed. In other words, we will channel the limited resources or prioritise so that first timers and the repeaters who are amenable and responsive to treatment and who desire to kick the habit will get the greatest attention. For those who are not amenable and not as responsive, they will still be given rehabilitative counselling and other measures. But they may have to undergo a more vigorous and a more rigorous method of rehabilitation.

With regard to the specific regime, we will now introduce what we would call an "exit counselling scheme" for the first timers and repeaters who are responsive and amenable. This will be what I would refer to as a sort of modified suspended sentence concept, a very short sharp shock treatment for the first two weeks. They will be given intensive counselling, drug education, drills, and physical training, and if they are assessed to be suitable, they will be released and will be put under close supervision for two years. What is the advantage of this? The advantage of this is we try to identify those who will benefit from the rehabilitation system and try to release them earlier. In other words, they can see the light at the end of the tunnel and need not necessarily be subject to two years' or three years' stay in the DRC. It will be a great incentive for them to respond to rehabilitation. For the others who may not be as amenable, the repeaters, the hard core as well as the first timers who are not so responsive, they will be subjected to the five stage rehabilitation system. But even within this group we will try and identify those who are more responsive, and they will be given a two months intensive counselling - a special programme for the repeaters who are more responsive. This will include counselling, drug education, vocational skills, community service and so on. We will ask them to volunteer also at the end of the five-stage rehabilitation system to see who are those who desire to do something for themselves to kick the system. The others will follow the normal DRC programme, which could be two to three years.

I agree with the Member for Tanah Merah that the DRC system should not be a soft escapism or outlet for escapism where addicts find it a venue to have a refresher course on supply of drugs and so on. Indeed, some of the detainees might have found it an outlet for a soft stay in a centre. But this will change. We will take a no-nonsense attitude and the new rehabilitation system will also mean that all the addicts will be put on notice that the DRC scheme will expect them to do quite a bit on their part to kick the habit. Where previously there have been cases of indiscipline and some have tried to damage property, we will have to resolve this, if necessary, by even amending legislation to empower those in charge of the centres with powers to take action against cases of indiscipline. There is a defect in the law, in the sense that the Misuse of Drugs Act does not give adequate powers to the administrators of these centres to deal with cases of indiscipline.

If I might now turn to the point raised by the Member for Pasir Panjang concerning the effectiveness of the various measures. I think all Members are familiar with the umbrella of measures which we have to fight drug trafficking, capital punishment, preventive detention where witnesses are fearful of reprisals, denial of passports to drug traffickers, detector dogs and so on. In addition to these, Members will also have read of additional measures taken recently to combat the problem of ant trafficking. One of these measures was the introduction of the instant urine testing at the Causeway to detect ant traffickers. The problem was that previously, when we did not have the equipment, it could not be done on the spot and persons had to be asked to wait for several days before the results of the urine testing was available. Now instant urine testing has been introduced officially since Monday, two days ago, and I am glad to report that it has proved effective. Over the past two days and up to 10 a.m. this morning, the instant urine testing mechanism and the screening at the Causeway has thrown up 12 positive cases. Prior to Monday, there was a period since 15th March when we tried it on an experimental basis, and from 15th March till Monday, 17 persons were detected. One had three straws of heroin concealed in his mouth and another had two straws hidden in his wallet. I am glad to say that the detection of 29 cases within this short period shows that it is successful. It also means that when non-Singaporeans are detected in this way, they are not allowed entry at all; they are turned away. And when there is greater publicity of this, it should serve as a deterrent.

The other additional measure is the formation of the Woodlands Task Force which involves very close cooperation between the Police, the Customs and CNB which results in conducting secondary non-routine checks. This has also paid off, as you would have read in the newspaper recently.

Another measure, if I may refer to it, concerns the point raised in recent dialogue sessions. A suggestion has been made for greater scrutiny of passport applications. This is a valid point because people, especially in the young age group, can easily cross the Causeway to obtain supplies. The point which was made in the dialogue sessions has been accepted in principle by the Central Narcotics Board and it will be implemented. The measures taken to implement it include the following:

There will be very careful scrutiny of applications for passports by those particularly in the age group 20 to 30. An overwhelming majority of drug addicts fall in this age group. Those in this age group may be required to give further particulars to enable the authorities to be satisfied that they are applying for passports for bona fide purposes, and they may have to furnish additional documents when applying for passports. The Central Narcotics Bureau will establish offices next to each of the passports - issuing centres at South Bridge Road, Joo Chiat Complex and Outram Road. Where necessary, applicants for these passports will be referred to CNB for interview and where the CNB and Immigration are not satisfied, the applicants may either be denied passports or may be only issued with single journey travel documents.

Sir, our war on drugs is not over. As we solve one problem, new manifestations of the problem may surface. In 1977 we had to resort to a wide variety of novel and tough measures. So long as our war against drugs is not over, we must continue to be vigilant and come out with new innovative but effective measures to curb the problem, particularly when we are located so close to the Golden Triangle area and from which plentiful supplies emanate.

If I may now turn to the point raised by the Member for Toa Payoh. I should mention that the Misuse of Drugs Act does contain adequate provisions for the confiscation of vehicles used for transportation of drugs and this covers not only cars but also ships and aircraft. The procedure is like this. The confiscation of such vehicles used for transportation of drugs needs a court order upon conviction. If there is no prosecution, the vehicle which has been seized will be deemed forfeited to the Government if within one month there is no claimant. I would like to inform him that we have invoked this provision. Since 1982, 47 vehicles have been seized, of which 24 have been forfeited and 23 cases are still pending. So he can rest assured that there is power and it has been used and, where necessary, we will continue to use them.

Encik Ibrahim Othman: Sir, I thank the Minister for his reply and beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QH 1000 of the Main Estimates.

Sir, at present a work permit holder who marries a Singapore citizen without getting prior approval from the Commissioner for Employment is banned permanently from entering Singapore. He or she cannot even obtain a social visit pass. Most of these are young people and some have offsprings arising out of this association. This prohibition will mean that the family will be separated permanently. So can I ask the Minister whether he will consider, on compassionate grounds, granting such people a social visit pass after a given period of time when they are banned from entering Singapore?

Prof. Jayakumar: Sir, the work permit marriage restriction policy has been implemented since July 1973 to discourage immigrant workers from settling here permanently through marriage to a citizen or permanent resident. Under this policy, work permit holders are required to obtain approval of the Commissioner for Employment before marrying a citizen or permanent resident. Initially, work permit holders who contravened the policy were barred from entry for a limited period of time. Various disincentives in the area of public housing and education were also applied to them. However, with the lapse of time, the limited ban and disincentives were found to be ineffective in achieving the objective of the policy.

In 1984, the Government decided to impose a permanent ban on the entry of non-residents who contravened the marriage restriction policy. Members will recall that this decision was given wide publicity in the local media by the Ministry of Labour in 1984. Individual work permit holders are also warned separately through an endorsement in their work permits that contravention of the policy would result in expulsion and a permanent bar to re-entry. Work permit holders who contravened the policy after July 1984 therefore had been sufficiently warned of the consequences of their action. The warning was done by way of an endorsement in their work permits and also during the interviews with the officers of the Work Permit Department when they applied for permission to contract marriages with Singapore citizens or permanent residents. In other words, they knew the consequences when they proceeded to marry after the disapproval of the Commissioner for Employment.

Sir, because of our manpower shortage, we will still have to rely on foreign sources of labour for some time. These foreign workers are here for a fixed term of employment which may be renewed for further periods. Where we can, we will absorb the skilled workers but others will be here only for the duration of their valid work permits. In other words, Sir, the work permit holders are able to be here for periods of two, three or more years only because they were allowed to come here for purposes of work. Others would not have been able to stay here under normal immigration rules if not for the work permit, and a condition is attached to the work permit that before they marry they should seek the approval of the Ministry of Labour. If the condition is breached, they knew what the consequences were. In 1984, a full explanation was given that the limited one-year blacklisting plus restricted visits thereafter was not proving effective, and there were several thousand contravention cases. It was to make it more effective that the permanent ban was introduced.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, in view of the Minister's reply, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Sir, I beg to move,

That the sum to be allocated for Head Q be reduced by $10 in respect of Code QI 1000 of the Main Estimates.

The Minister has announced the issue of new identity cards. Since it affects the vast majority of the population the registration process should be made more convenient. I would like to ask whether the Minister will give some information on the registration process. For example, whether there will be teams to register school children, in institutions of higher learning, unions, places of work and community centres. I ask this because in the exercise when they renewed the old cardboard identity cards to the present plastic ones, such registration process was extended to these centres that I have stated.

The last question I want to ask is why is it necessary to have another re-registration at the age of 30 years.

The Senior Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Home Affairs (Mr Chin Harn Tong): Sir, the Member for Toa Payoh raised two questions. Firstly, he wants to know what is the registration process for the issue of new identity cards and, secondly, he wants to know the need to introduce an additional re-registration at the age of 30 years.

The reply to his first question is that the present practice of sending mobile teams from the National Registration Office to schools to register students for identity cards will continue when the new NRIC conversion exercise takes place. To make it more convenient for the public, the conversion to the new NRICs will also take place at the community centres. This will be done constituency by constituency. There are plans to register people for the new NRICs daily, including Saturdays and Sundays. Those affected will be informed in advance of the dates, venues and procedures for the conversion exercise. The details are being worked out and will be made known nearer the dates of implementation.

Sir, regarding his second question, I wish to explain that under the existing system, we first get our identity cards at the age of 12 years and re-register for a new identity card at the age of 17 years. I am sure the Members will agree with me that a photograph taken at the age of 17 will show no close resemblance to the identity card holder because his facial features continue to change significantly after 17 years and only stabilize at about 30 years old. I am sure Members will also agree with me that it is an embarrassment for an identity card holder to claim that he is indeed the youthful person depicted in the photograph. Therefore, this additional re-registration at the age of 30 is meant to assist the adult population by providing them an identity card with a photograph that bears close resemblance to its holder. It will also enable the National Registration Office to update the personal particulars of the identity card holder, such as his marital status, address and occupation.

The Chairman: Are you withdrawing your amendment?

Mr Eric Cheong Yuen Chee: Yes.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn

Mr Chiam See Tong: I have not submitted a cut, but may I be allowed to speak?

The Chairman: No, I am sorry. Under the rules you are not allowed to. We have finished every amendment on the Order Paper.

Mr Chiam See Tong: We have 5 minutes more.

The Chairman: No. When we have finished, we move on to the next Head.

The sum of $382,134,700 for Head Q ordered to stand part of the Main Estimates.

The sum of $172,749,800 for Head Q ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates. CLAUSE:

3.45 pm

Head N -

The Chairman: Amendment No. (1), 39 minutes. Dr Augustine Tan.

Dr Augustine H.H. Tan (Whampoa): Sir, I beg to move,

That the total sum to be allocated for Head N of the Main Estimates be reduced by $100.

I move this amendment to discuss a number of issues. May I take up the first one on the soundness of Singapore's Financial Institutions.

Sir, during the debate on the Budget Statement, I commented on the correctness of our fiscal, monetary, wage and savings policies of our country. I also alluded to the uncertainties in the global economy within which we have to operate. Perhaps we may want to take a quick look at our external position. Members would note that our balance of payments last year was in surplus to the extent of $2.3 billion which included the current account surplus of $1.1 billion. Our external reserves rose to $30.4 billion which represented 5.3 months of total imports or 7.8 months of retained imports. We have a low inflation rate as measured by the cost of living index 0.5%. Our external debt was remarkably low compared to all other nations. We owed a mere $303 million, and the Singapore Dollar was strong and stable.

This strong external position of ours would stand us in good stead in facing the global uncertainties. We are vulnerable in two regards. Firstly, because of our dependence on trade and foreign investments; and secondly, because of our financial integration with the global monetary system. I have mentioned the fragility of the global situation in respect of the heavy indebtedness of countries, particularly the developing countries. And there are the huge trade imbalances among the major powers, particularly the US vis-a-vis Japan and West Germany, and the need to rely upon monetary policy to make economic adjustments which makes for exchange rate instability. At the same time, the pressures of protectionism are mounting. There are therefore possible threats of instability to Singapore.

In October last year we already experienced a stock market crash. As it turned out, the Pan-El crisis in 1985 was a blessing in disguise because it led us to institute a number of very good reforms of the stock market, as a result of which we were able to withstand the stock market crisis of last year. The possibility of another stock market crash cannot be dismissed.

Another possibility lies in the collapse of financial institutions on a global basis. And it is this possibility that has caused me to raise certain questions with the Finance Minister about our own financial institutions. Members would note from the Economic Survey Report that the Asian Dollar Market last year rose to US$245 billion. Of this amount, inter-bank funds held outside Singapore by the system totalled US$140 billion, and inter-bank funds owned by foreign banks in Singapore amounted to US$160 billion. As for our domestic banking system, in 1987 the total assets were S$87 billion. Of these total assets, the assets held by our banks abroad amounted to $25 billion or 28% of the total, whereas the liabilities which were due to foreign banks held in our banking system amounted to $28 billion or 32% of the total liabilities. At the same time, Sir, the capitalization plus reserves of our domestic banks amounted to only $6.4 billion or only 7.4% of total bank liabilities. I do not have the figures for capital and reserves for the Asian Dollar Market. Perhaps the Minister might refer to that.

But, Sir, these figures illustrate for us the degree, the extent of our financial integration with the global monetary system. Yes, we have benefited a great deal from this integration but at the same time it does pose dangers to us. So my question to the Finance Minister is: how do we protect our financial institutions in the event - and let's hope it does not happen - but in the event of an international financial collapse?

The Minister for Finance (Dr Richard Hu Tsu Tau): Sir, the Member for Whampoa has asked questions concerning the financial stability of Singapore's financial system and what steps can be taken to ensure that the system stays together in the event of an international crisis. Because this subject is of importance, I intend to respond at some length, as it may be of interest not only to the Member but also to the public at large.

As a general statement, I can say that I am satisfied that the financial system in Singapore at the present time is fundamentally sound. The important components of the financial system which I will touch on include local banks, the branches or subsidiaries of foreign banks, finance companies and securities companies trading on the Stock Exchange of Singapore and the Singapore International Monetary Exchange. I will not deal with insurance companies as they are not deposit-taking entities nor with the Post Office Savings Bank as it is a Government institution. But before doing so, I will describe briefly the supervisory system we have in Singapore which controls the financial system.

The Monetary Authority of Singapore is the body responsible for the supervision and control of all financial institutions in Singapore. Its powers are exercised through a number of investor protection acts or laws, all of which were introduced or amended within the last five years to take into account the many recent changes in financial practices and the inter-linking of financial institutions worldwide. These include the Banking Act, the Monetary Authority of Singapore Act, the Finance Companies Act, the Securities Industry Act and the Futures Trading Act.

I will now describe briefly the main components of our financial system. Firstly, local banks. The best testimony to the soundness of the local banking sector is that there is no record of a local banking failing in Singapore's banking history. Over the years, however, a number of mergers and acquisitions have taken place, with the stronger banks absorbing or taking over the weaker institutions. At the present time, there are 13 banks owned and controlled by Singaporeans. They have total assets of some S$51 billion as at the end of 1987. All these banks meet the 26% liquidity ratio required by law; and as a group they have capital/asset ratios exceeding 13% which is substantially higher than the 6% ratio common to banks in the United States. They are also all profitable. The quality of the local banks loan books is satisfactory with adequate provision of loan-loss reserves. There is negligible exposure to the problem of LDC debt overseas and adequate provision has been made for the little that exists. The October stock market crash had no significant effect on the local banks, as they practised conservative investment policies. Overall, I am satisfied with the health of our local banks.

Secondly, foreign banks. Foreign banks in Singapore operate either as branches or merchant bank subsidiaries of the parent banks. Currently, there are 123 foreign bank branches and 64 merchant bank subsidiaries operating in Singapore. The majority of the foreign banks in Singapore operate Asian Currency Units, 116 of them, within the offshore banking system which deals in currencies other than the Singapore Dollar. The size of the ACU market currently exceeds US$200 billion. Although only 22 foreign banks hold full banking licences, all 123 of them are allowed to operate in the domestic Singapore Dollar system, and they account for some 40% or the sum amount involving S$49 billion of the domestic banking system's non-bank deposits and 58% or equivalent of $22 billion of Singapore dollar loans. They handle well over 90% of the offshore ACU market which has an asset size, as I mentioned earlier, exceeding US$200 billion.

As the foreign banks' operations in Singapore account for less than 10% of the global operation of the parent banks, the financial soundness of these banks is more appropriately and more accurately assessed on a consolidated basis at the Head Office of parent bank level. Because the foreign banks' parent companies operate outside Singapore's jurisdiction, control of quality can only be exercised by setting high admission requirements. The MAS has strict entry criteria for foreign banks that wish to establish branches or merchant banks in Singapore. Among the factors considered are financial soundness, international ranking and ability to contribute to develop Singapore as a financial centre. All the applicants must be properly supervised in their home countries and the Home Supervisory Authority's views are sought on the banks' financial condition and quality of manage- ment. The entry criteria applied so far have ensured that no foreign banks which were allowed to open branches in Singapore or merchant banks have collapsed with loss of depositor funds. However, two large foreign banks with branches in Singapore did encounter financial difficulties at the parent company level but they were rescued by their governments.

The Chairman: Order. Moment of Interruption.

Thereupon Mr Deputy Speaker left the Chair of the Committee and took the Chair of the House.

Dr Richard Hu Tsu Tau: Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to report that the Com- mittee of Supply has made further progress on the Main and Development Estimates for the financial year 1988/89, and ask leave to sit again tomorrow.

Mr Deputy Speaker: So be it.